North and South - First Manassas 1.0 [in progress]

[Dithon1]

No...
We have 2 different ideas, how we could arrange it.

1) Both would have 2 rifles to choose, one accurate rifle with minor melee ability (no bayonet), or a more inaccurate rifle, but with bayonet.

2) 1 historical rifle for each class (like springfield 42 for the south, harpers ferry for the north), but both would have different stats. Like CS rifles better in melee, US rifles better in accuracy.

I want a difference in each army.. It would be boring, if both factions are the same.

So is the Harper's Ferry rifle going to have a bayonet or not?

What weapons are you looking to equip both factions with? Which unit types will get which specific weapons?

And what with the melee speed? Confederate 42 rifles are way slower then the union 55 in the current N&S

This is true. The 1842 (bayoneted) has a speed of 70. The 1855 (bayoneted) has a speed of 85.

[NicolasKiyoshi]

No...
We have 2 different ideas, how we could arrange it.

1) Both would have 2 rifles to choose, one accurate rifle with minor melee ability (no bayonet), or a more inaccurate rifle, but with bayonet.

2) 1 historical rifle for each class (like springfield 42 for the south, harpers ferry for the north), but both would have different stats. Like CS rifles better in melee, US rifles better in accuracy.

I want a difference in each army.. It would be boring, if both factions are the same.

Why don't you just simply add the sword bayonet to the Mississippi Rifle? First of all, could you do like they do in Iron Europe? There you can can both fix your bayonet, which is in occupying a slot in your inventory or simply use it alone if you wish. Also, it would be more historically accurate and nice to have sword bayonets ingame.

Images:
http://relicman.com/weapons/imageweapon/W1221A.JPG
http://relicman.com/weapons/imageweapon/W1008J.JPG

[Dithon1]

No...
We have 2 different ideas, how we could arrange it.

1) Both would have 2 rifles to choose, one accurate rifle with minor melee ability (no bayonet), or a more inaccurate rifle, but with bayonet.

2) 1 historical rifle for each class (like springfield 42 for the south, harpers ferry for the north), but both would have different stats. Like CS rifles better in melee, US rifles better in accuracy.

I want a difference in each army.. It would be boring, if both factions are the same.

Why don't you just simply add the sword bayonet to the Mississippi Rifle? First of all, could you do like they do in Iron Europe? There you can can both fix your bayonet, which is in occupying a slot in your inventory or simply use it alone if you wish. Also, it would be more historically accurate and nice to have sword bayonets ingame.

Images:
http://relicman.com/weapons/imageweapon/W1221A.JPG
http://relicman.com/weapons/imageweapon/W1008J.JPG

Same for the Lorenz Rifle and Enfield 1853. Those you wouldn't even have to get new models for - just re-use the spike bayonet you already have.

[Incognitoandahalf]

I think you guys are missing his point. If every gun had Bayonets melee would get rather stale, so to spice things up some units will have to weight their options on which gun to take. While to some it may seem unfair its adding flavor and making command decision matter, unlike in NW where all guns are standard. AT some point historical accuracy needs to take a back seat to game play and realistically if all guns had bayonets the choice between rifles would become less important. Its those difficult choices that can make the game more fun, like to I want a lower accuracy higher damage Burnside or a more accurate but survivable sharps carbine. Without choices like these whats to keep this game from being an accuracy boost to NW?

[Dithon1]

Without choices like these whats to keep this game from being an accuracy boost to NW?

If every gun had Bayonets melee would get rather stale, so to spice things up some units will have to weight their options on which gun to take.

This choice is already in NW in the same form as it is currently in NaS. I hate it in NW, and I hate it in NaS. Why is there a "sword bayonet" for my Baker Rifle on my belt if I can't use it as a bayonet? Those Hussars are closing fast; If I were an actual British Rifleman in 1810 I'd fix my sword bayonet, but I guess it's time to prepare my anus.

AT some point historical accuracy needs to take a back seat to game play and realistically if all guns had bayonets the choice between rifles would become less important.

If you make three tools all designed for the same job, but one of them is better at it in every way than the rest, what real choice is there?

Its those difficult choices that can make the game more fun, like to I want a lower accuracy higher damage Burnside or a more accurate but survivable sharps carbine.

This is somewhat inaccurate. On paper, all three carbines do the same damage. There are only two differences between them at this point: Their accuracy, and the velocity of the bullet they shoot. Whether projectiles are actually subject to damage bonuses from said velocity like melee attacks are is unclear (to me, at least). The least accurate gun (Burns) shoots the fastest bullet. The most accurate (Sharps) shoots the slowest bullet. What I have noticed is that I'll often hit more targets with the more inaccurate gun because of its increased projectile speed. I don't have to lead as much over longer distances, you see.

[Dithon1]

This forum is stupid. Why is there no delete post button?

[LFCJames]

I am sure, most of you will hate me for that... but I want to introduce the 2nd Maine Infantry. One of the most important union regiments at Manassas.
They were the first on the field and the last regiment, which left the Battlefield.

Like many other union regiment, the 2nd Maine showed up in their fancy pre-war uniform.

Those CSA-Monkeys wont suspect a thing!

All I need to see as a skirmisher, is their shiny Springfield, soon to be mine

[Bravescot]

All I want is something that I can go bang and pew with and something I can do some stabby goodness with.

[BSM 'Shut up' Williams]

Watching, The Red Badge of Courage makes me wanna play this version of the mod so much!

[Hinkel]

Made a small test, so you get a view on a 3D model, not just a screenshot.

Just click on the picture.

[Earth Bby]

I like the trousers

[KillerShark]

I really like that uniform

[Hinkel]

I really like that uniform

To be honest, it was not really an uniform. The 1st Minnesota had regular sack coats at Manassas, but due to the heat that day, many soldiers took of their jackets and just wear their shirt
This picture was nearly for every unit at the Battle.



I love that reenactment picture:

Spoiler

[close]

[BSM 'Shut up' Williams]

They may have different uniforms, but boy do they sure look nice.

[Incognitoandahalf]

This choice is already in NW in the same form as it is currently in NaS. I hate it in NW, and I hate it in NaS. Why is there a "sword bayonet" for my Baker Rifle on my belt if I can't use it as a bayonet? Those Hussars are closing fast; If I were an actual British Rifleman in 1810 I'd fix my sword bayonet, but I guess it's time to prepare my anus.

What fun would the game be if every unit had a bayonet but some guns were more accurate? You have always argued for game play before accuracy Dithon, tell me how that is fair?

If you make three tools all designed for the same job, but one of them is better at it in every way than the rest, what real choice is there?

Look in North and South and you will find 4 common swords (there are more but they are rarely seen) the 1860 saber, 1840 saber, 1850 staff sword, and the NCO sword. Which one is better? Is it the fast 1860, the long and hard hitting 1840, the long and powerful 1850 or the short and swift NCO. All swords yes, all designed to kill people, but all designed in different contexts, the same holds true for the variety of swords in NW. You wont realisticly find something that is better in every possible way because then nobody would use anything different, considering both rifled muskets and rifles were used in the Civil War speaks to the point that there was no one perfect solution.

This is somewhat inaccurate. On paper, all three carbines do the same damage. There are only two differences between them at this point: Their accuracy, and the velocity of the bullet they shoot. Whether projectiles are actually subject to damage bonuses from said velocity like melee attacks are is unclear (to me, at least). The least accurate gun (Burns) shoots the fastest bullet. The most accurate (Sharps) shoots the slowest bullet. What I have noticed is that I'll often hit more targets with the more inaccurate gun because of its increased projectile speed. I don't have to lead as much over longer distances, you see.

Dithon I can assure you from a code standpoint and a game play standpoint the Burnside is the least accurate but most powerful carbine. If you don't believe me you can break out the code and see for yourself, or even better look at the nice pretty file provided in the module that spells out the stats in plain English. As for your experience with the Burnside that's more of a personal perspective and if it works for you that is great, however I'm just laying bare the stats.