Flying Squirrel Entertainment

Mount & Blade Warband: Napoleonic Wars => Community => Topic started by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 03:59:00 pm

Title: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 03:59:00 pm
You'll finally hear it from the other point of view.
 
You have to realise that Tavington has spent 1000s of £s over the years to set-up, maintain and upgrade the 91st servers - a fundament to all major regiments.
 
By this reasoning, 91st's Costs = Tavington's Costs.
 
Tavington may have taken excess donations, the odd 10-20 euros, but the truth of the matter is that he has made a huge net financial loss on the regiment.
 
Tavington also made it very clear when advertising donations that he 'spent a lot of money himself on server costs, and is looking for some financial support to help keep the servers going'. So it was pretty damned clear that when 91st members donated to the regiment they'd be donating to Tavington, in essence: helping Tav help 91st.
 
A few disgruntled members decided to paint this as malicious fraudulence. They had ulterior motives; they had fallen out with Tavington. And whilst many of the members have had issues with Tavington's personality at one point or another, no one wanted the disbandment of the regiment over this (they'd have simply left the regiment if they didn't like being there).
 
The reason why the regiment disbanded was a mismanagement of communication and trust between Tavington and the members. He should have been more explicit about how the donations system worked so that disgruntled members could not nitpick holes in it and destabalize the regiment as a result. They quickly manufactured the half-truths that Tavington was embezzling money in a money-grubbing/profiteering sense of the word.
 
It is abundantly clear once you have heard both sides of the story, when you consider the reality of funding of the regiment, when you consider how apologetic and remorseful Tavington was in disbanding his regiment over this, that this was not malicious whatsoever. And the more that time passes, the more ex-91st members are realising this and the more the FSE community should realise it too.
 
In light of many FSE members' recent vulgar attitudes/celebrations towards 91st members on this forum, the 91st have personally asked Tavington to reform the regiment for our own pride's sake. We will be defining how we exit this community, not the community. We also have unfinished business here in regards to tournaments and competitions.
 
So sorry to be a party-pooper, but you'll have to put your celebratory paraphernalia back in the closet for the time being. We're back.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Warder on October 06, 2013, 04:03:02 pm
4me it's funny. TAV WAS POCKETING MONEYZZZZ... I think that he just wanted to had reserve, cuz sometimes as my friend told me, he paid alone for the servers
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Emperor Napoleon on October 06, 2013, 04:05:03 pm
So you're saying that he is a good guy?  :o
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Riddlez on October 06, 2013, 04:06:22 pm
The reason why the regiment disbanded was a mismanagement of communication and trust between Tavington and the members. He should have been more explicit about how the donations system worked so that disgruntled members could not nitpick holes in it and destabalize the regiment as a result. They quickly manufactured the half-truths that Tavington was embezzling money in a money-grubbing/profiteering sense of the word.

If that is true, it's still Tav's fault. Simple as that.

And, the problem with this story is.. No proof. No proof that this is true, whatsoever.
And Jigstas has some valid arguments about.

And the fact that at every single other occasion where Tav needed a lawyer, you showed up, so I don't really think
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 04:07:13 pm
So you're saying that he is a good guy?  :o

This isn't about Tav's personality, it's about the allegations against him. This scandal should not have led to disbanding the regiment really. If we wanted the regiment disbanded as individual members we'd all have simply left. This is why we are reforming.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: The Nutty Pig on October 06, 2013, 04:09:27 pm
Hasn't someone taken the 91st now though? Because on the old regiment thread it said that you had officially disbanded. Don't want to cause trouble (for a change) just want to know if you have talked to the mods about this or anything?
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 04:14:52 pm
Hasn't someone taken the 91st now though? Because on the old regiment thread it said that you had officially disbanded. Don't want to cause trouble (for a change) just want to know if you have talked to the mods about this or anything?

If it needs to be lawyered, Tavington never said he was 'disbanding', that was something assumed/implied:
 
"It's been a great time people and in the end it was me and me alone who is to blame for the failure of the Regiment. We accomplished a lot in our time and we were undoubtedly the best Regiment in NW, nobody can question that, I wish all of you the best of luck in your future endeavours."
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Rydog on October 06, 2013, 04:16:30 pm
It might look bad, but I think people need to take a step back and realise how funding works. If he spends 60 out of his own pocket one week, he is -60 in funding. If he then is 20 over next week, and pockets it, he is still -40 in funding.

That donation still went and will go towards funding the server. If he was consistently receiving over the amount of the server costs monthly (which I HIGHLY doubt, some proof of that would go down a treat) then yeah, he was stealing. But if not, its just funding guys, you might wanna think about that for a while.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Mack on October 06, 2013, 04:17:44 pm
I like to hear from both sides, but one simply question; why did Tavington fake the invoices then? ( as people claim he did )
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Joseph Graham on October 06, 2013, 04:18:11 pm
Locking a thread and making a closing statement is usually tantamount to disbanding a regiment. Given the circumstances surrounding this little spat I'd imagine a new identity might be far more beneficial; there's a stigma attached to that name now.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Mr T on October 06, 2013, 04:18:37 pm
Spoiler
Burn the witch! Burn it at the stake! Heresy! Burn the witch!
[close]

No more, got it? No more.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Maurice on October 06, 2013, 04:24:00 pm
I guess I will be the one to vacuum clean the confetti...
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 04:24:19 pm
I like to hear from both sides, but one simply question; why did Tavington fake the invoices then? ( as people claim he did )

Because once those disgruntled members had planted these 'malicious conspiracies' in the heads of many of the members he panicked. Even the mighty Tavington has spells of misjudgement and incompetence. When something as big as your regiment of 3 years is at stake people sometimes don't think clearly.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Duuring on October 06, 2013, 04:25:06 pm
It's very simple.

Did Tavington take money that was given to be spent on servers and servers alone? Yes? Then he stole it. The amount does not matter.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 04:26:32 pm
It's very simple.

Did Tavington take money that was given to be spent on servers and servers alone? Yes? Then he stole it. The amount does not matter.

91sts's paypal account = Tavington's paypal account. Tavington pays for the server when no one else can. How is he stealing? Members just put money into a deposit for the server. You just want to believe it's worse than it is. The allegations are pretty ridiculous.
 
The only thing Tavington is guilty of was a brief spell of deceitfulness with that invoice. This was all caused by a few members' smear story though, they were determined to bring down our 91st community.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Mack on October 06, 2013, 04:28:23 pm
It's very simple.

Did Tavington take money that was given to be spent on servers and servers alone? Yes? Then he stole it. The amount does not matter.

91sts's paypal account = Tavington's paypal account. Tavington pays for the server when no one else can. How is he stealing? Members just put money into a deposit for the server. You just want to believe it's worse than it is.

Duuring means, that if Tavington said he'd only spend it on servers, but he also spend it on personal use, people can consider it as stealing.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Duuring on October 06, 2013, 04:32:06 pm
Exactly. If you tell people it's only for server use, yet you take it for personal use, it's lying and stealing. Whether you spend a lot of money yourself in the servers makes no difference.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Cara on October 06, 2013, 04:32:37 pm
4me it's funny. TAV WAS POCKETING MONEYZZZZ... I think that he just wanted to had reserve, cuz sometimes as my friend told me, he paid alone for the servers

Are you not tired to be retarded ?
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: tacticalretreat on October 06, 2013, 04:34:04 pm
to be honest i'm sick of hearing about it now :) I think its best everyone leaves the 91st to rebuild for a bit and watch in awe as they come back to conquer the world again :P
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Warder on October 06, 2013, 04:37:23 pm
4me it's funny. TAV WAS POCKETING MONEYZZZZ... I think that he just wanted to had reserve, cuz sometimes as my friend told me, he paid alone for the servers

Are you not tired to be retarded ?
snip
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Cara on October 06, 2013, 04:45:09 pm
4me it's funny. TAV WAS POCKETING MONEYZZZZ... I think that he just wanted to had reserve, cuz sometimes as my friend told me, he paid alone for the servers

Are you not tired to be retarded ?
snip

Okay, seems you are not tired. I will enjoy to ban you next time I see you on TS or server
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Warder on October 06, 2013, 04:46:50 pm
And so he spoke and so he spoke, that lord of IVe ts...
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: John Cameron on October 06, 2013, 04:50:32 pm
Can you all not just leave them alone? This is more about gossip than what actually happened. The only people who would have a real reason to discuss this are members or ex-members of the 91st who donated money to Tavington. No one else. If they can not solve it alone than they might be able to ask a neutral group to help. But I doubt any of this here will help to solve this. No one knows what really happened.

The majority of the 91st members obviously stays behind their leader. I am sure this will be solved but it does not take all kind of people who do not even know Tavington or the 91st to do this.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: [91st] Official on October 06, 2013, 04:52:55 pm
Can you all not just leave them alone? This is more about gossip than what actually happened. The only people who would have a real reason to discuss this are members or ex-members of the 91st who donated money to Tavington. No one else. If they can not solve it alone than they might be able to ask a neutral group to help. But I doubt any of this here will help to solve this. No one knows what really happened.

The majority of the 91st members obviously stays behind their leader. I am sure this will be solved but it does not take all kind of people who do not even know Tavington or the 91st to do this.

I agree. This is a matter of the 91st community, not the NW community as a whole.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Primus69 on October 06, 2013, 04:54:19 pm
Well, I'm glad to see the 91st back on its feet. I did feel sorry for the members or ex-members yesterday when half the community were chanting/laughing at them for their regiment disbanding. I think it shows how many people want to see all the good regiments die within the community. 91st is, in my opinion, one of the best line infantry regiments. And without them them you would have all of these rubbish regiments by which tournaments/events/linebattles would not be a challenge. In agreement with John Cameron's comments, it is a matter that the 91st are real people. Just because you despise Tav for one reason or another there is no need to flame the members that worked years to keep that regiment going. 
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Blitz on October 06, 2013, 04:59:45 pm
For the people who tried and failed to bring down this glorious Regiment have only made it stronger.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: RyanBoss on October 06, 2013, 05:03:20 pm
But didn't Tavington take the decision himself to disband after his deceitful behaviour was outed? Or are you saying he was forced into the position?

Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Carolus. on October 06, 2013, 05:09:46 pm
The only people who would have a real reason to discuss this are members or ex-members of the 91st who donated money to Tavington. No one else.

If the 91st wants to take care of this matter themselves they really should stop creating threads in the forums about it. :-*

Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: TheSnowHindu on October 06, 2013, 05:14:36 pm
I dont really have vested interest in either side. Unlike most of the community, I dont think I know tavington well enough to make a judgement on him but I respect the efforts you have gone through to defend your friend publicly. Its not big news like the 91st disbanding that makes a community a community, its lads sticking by their friends. Good on you evan.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: ChocolateAce on October 06, 2013, 05:18:04 pm
you know shits going down when you need an attorney to play a video game  8)
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Oakenshield on October 06, 2013, 05:23:01 pm
The only people who would have a real reason to discuss this are members or ex-members of the 91st who donated money to Tavington. No one else.

If the 91st wants to take care of this matter themselves they really should stop creating threads in the forums about it. :-*

Maybe if everyone stopped mocking the 91st and its members then we wouldn't feel the need to defend ourselves.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: PhonieX on October 06, 2013, 05:26:28 pm
Tavington NEVER stole, when he asked for donations, he never mentioned it was for serverbox costs only. He said he needed donations to help the regiment, and also for the serverbox costs.
Tavington has payed so many times alone, to keep the 91st running.
He is not deserving of being accused of stealing.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Carolus. on October 06, 2013, 05:46:06 pm
The only people who would have a real reason to discuss this are members or ex-members of the 91st who donated money to Tavington. No one else.

If the 91st wants to take care of this matter themselves they really should stop creating threads in the forums about it. :-*

Maybe if everyone stopped mocking the 91st and its members then we wouldn't feel the need to defend ourselves.

Defend? That only says they get to you. Just ignore it instead. Its unfortunate Tavs crime makes the community mock the 91st members, they are innocent and should be left at peace
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Duuring on October 06, 2013, 05:59:28 pm
Tavington NEVER stole, when he asked for donations, he never mentioned it was for serverbox costs only. He said he needed donations to help the regiment, and also for the serverbox costs.
Tavington has payed so many times alone, to keep the 91st running.
He is not deserving of being accused of stealing.

When you ask people to donate into the regiment, and it you take it into your own pocket, it's stealing. It was his decision to spend so much money into the regiment, that gives him no right to take that of others 'to make up for it'.

It's stealing, nothing else.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Carolus. on October 06, 2013, 06:03:26 pm
Tavington NEVER stole, when he asked for donations, he never mentioned it was for serverbox costs only. He said he needed donations to help the regiment, and also for the serverbox costs.
Tavington has payed so many times alone, to keep the 91st running.
He is not deserving of being accused of stealing.

When you ask people to donate into the regiment, and it you take it into your own pocket, it's stealing. It was his decision to spend so much money into the regiment, that gives him no right to take that of others 'to make up for it'.

It's stealing, nothing else.

indeed
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: James on October 06, 2013, 06:19:41 pm
Glad that's cleared up. Also when I was a member the regiment the donation goal was hardly ever reached. Best of luck in the future.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Riddlez on October 06, 2013, 06:24:49 pm
I guess I'll see Tav in the international court if justice in The Hague in a few.


Cya.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Krotan on October 06, 2013, 06:27:38 pm
I guess I'll see Tav in the international court if justice in The Hague in a few.


Cya.
Oh please.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Malakith on October 06, 2013, 06:30:33 pm
On topic and useful or you know where this ends up.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Blitz on October 06, 2013, 06:31:21 pm
I guess I'll see Tav in the international court if justice in The Hague in a few.


Cya.
Do people ever stop?
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: MR_Cheath on October 06, 2013, 06:35:30 pm
Too bad internet regiments need donations in the first place.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: PhonieX on October 06, 2013, 06:41:30 pm
I would suggest closing this thread, until the guys that flames Tavington, comes up with some evidence, that he stole.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Duuring on October 06, 2013, 06:56:49 pm
You said it happened but it wasn't stealing, and now you deny it even happening.

Way to go.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Suede on October 06, 2013, 06:59:22 pm
You'll finally hear it from the other point of view.
Is there anywhere point of view about all this from Tavington personally?
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Commissar Jdf on October 06, 2013, 06:59:52 pm
Hurry! Call 911! Someone has stolen my funds over the iiiiinnnntttteeerrrnnneeettt!
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Carolus. on October 06, 2013, 07:03:48 pm
I would suggest closing this thread, until the guys that flames Tavington, comes up with some evidence, that he stole.

Didnt someone post a screenshot with faked invoices in another thread?
Best would probably be if he posted his own version here(if he's not still banned) instead of the someone else posting it trying to justify his actions. But yeah, do I really care... no. Whatever happens I wish you all good luck and have fun.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Jigstas on October 06, 2013, 07:10:28 pm
Firstly I myself donated donated near of 630 pounds, around 774 Euros,  from December 2012 until around June 2013. Which I am happy to post proof of. This alone would have covered the cost of the server for 7 months. With 4 Euros still left over. Is Tav seriously saying that in those 7 months not one person donated? Also what date exactly did Tav set up the server box?
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Chieef on October 06, 2013, 07:12:37 pm
Firstly I myself donated donated near of 690 pounds, around 815 Euros,  from December 2012 until around June 2013. Which I am happy to post proof of. This alone would have covered the cost of the server for 7 months. With 45 Euros still left over. Is Tav seriously saying that in those 7 months not one person donated? Also what date exactly did Tav set up the server box?

no pic=no proof
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Evanovic on October 06, 2013, 07:19:06 pm
Firstly I myself donated donated near of 690 pounds, around 815 Euros,  from December 2012 until around June 2013. Which I am happy to post proof of. This alone would have covered the cost of the server for 7 months. With 45 Euros still left over. Is Tav seriously saying that in those 7 months not one person donated? Also what date exactly did Tav set up the server box?

You've already made your point Jigstas. And don't think we aren't under the illusions that you paid your way to your Captain rank. You have your own thread to carry on your allegations if you wish, but the 91st members have made there point in this thread.
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Jigstas on October 06, 2013, 07:26:22 pm
Firstly nice ignoring of all my questions Evan. Did Tav recieve any donations during those 7 months? Hmmm. Ignoring such questions is only going to fuel the proof. I will happily unlock my thread but I do not want to as it was being trolled and flamed. I have no intention of the 91st being abused. I will keep posting my question. Did Tavington seriously not received a single donation to the regiment in those 7 months. And on the topic of me reaching the Captain rank I remember after I first donated Tav saying that I would get Cpl for it. I donated to keep the regiment going as Tav asked me for donations saying that he couldn't cover it ect
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Chieef on October 06, 2013, 07:32:00 pm
Firstly nice ignoring of all my questions Evan. Did Tav recieve any donations during those 7 months? Hmmm. Ignoring such questions is only going to fuel the proof. I will happily unlock my thread but I do not want to as it was being trolled and flamed. I have no intention of the 91st being abused. I will keep posting my question. Did Tavington seriously not received a single donation to the regiment in those 7 months. And on the topic of me reaching the Captain rank I remember after I first donated Tav saying that I would get Cpl for it. I donated to keep the regiment going as Tav asked me for donations saying that he couldn't cover it ect

no pic=no proof
Title: Re: The reality of the 91st Donations
Post by: Commissar Jdf on October 06, 2013, 07:37:24 pm
Firstly nice ignoring of all my questions Evan. Did Tav recieve any donations during those 7 months? Hmmm. Ignoring such questions is only going to fuel the proof. I will happily unlock my thread but I do not want to as it was being trolled and flamed. I have no intention of the 91st being abused. I will keep posting my question. Did Tavington seriously not received a single donation to the regiment in those 7 months. And on the topic of me reaching the Captain rank I remember after I first donated Tav saying that I would get Cpl for it. I donated to keep the regiment going as Tav asked me for donations saying that he couldn't cover it ect

no pic=no proof

a true agnostic!