Author Topic: The General Political Thread  (Read 529415 times)

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Norwegian13

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2550 on: February 17, 2018, 12:31:01 pm »
Whataboutism again Norwegian. The Russian troops had no legal right to be in the Crimea (except for the naval base). You’ve spoken to many people is such a vague term without much evidence to back it up or a good reflector of overall opinion. The vote was declared invalid by the UN, but of course Russia doesn’t care about that. The media is pretty tightly controlled in Russia so I’d be surprised to find a documentary that was against the takeover tbh.

Quite frankly, I don't care about the UN declaring the vote invalid because I know how the people in Crimea voted and that's all that matters. The countries that recognized the vote as invalid all had their own interests in mind. I told you, go see for yourself and talk to the local populace in Crimea, or find reports from western journalists that have been down there and have spoken to the local populace. Why on earth would anyone make a documentary against the reunification? Media is not tightly controlled at all, and people are free to do as they please. I know many people in Russia who are opposed to Putin, people who support Navalny etc. and nothing bad has happened to them. They're all living freely, nobody's harrassing them or oppressing them. They're openly sharing their views and there's no threat to them. And before you come to me with "hurr durr Russian police shut down their rallies", yes they did, because they were unsanctioned. They are blocking roads etc. causing trouble in the city, which of course would cause the police to have them be moved so that traffic could resume as per usual. If they actually would apply to hold their rallies and get a designated area for the rallies (which they have done in the past and it has happened with no problem) the police wouldn't touch them.

You need to take away this bullshit Western "hurr durr Russia is so bad no freedom" that you have and keep in mind that Russia is no longer the Soviet Union and is now a free democracy.

I've never heard of "whataboutism" before, but from a quick google search it seems like it's a simple term for you to try and discredit the facts me and Gojkov are presenting, when showing YOUR hypocrisy. The facts about Kosovo remain facts.

Have a good day. I'm not interested in discussing this any further because you're so blinded by the anti-Russian propaganda, so I don't think I'll be returning to this topic.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 12:38:41 pm by Noorwegian »

Offline Toffee

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2551 on: February 17, 2018, 12:41:55 pm »
If you googled whataboutism you would know that it’s a specific tactic to deflect from an indefensible subject by changing the topic. Surprisingly it was often used by the Soviets. Funny that isn’t it.

I suppose we’ll have to agree to disagree. Because if the fact that most of the world’s nations disagree with you isn’t enough then I doubt anything will be.

Offline Duuring

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2552 on: February 17, 2018, 01:33:45 pm »
Quote
I know many people in Russia who are opposed to Putin, people who support Navalny etc. and nothing bad has happened to them. They're all living freely, nobody's harrassing them or oppressing them

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/vladimir-putin-alexei-navalny-russia-election-1.4494643

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/02/15/russia-blocks-alexei-navalnys-website-investigation-oligarch/

https://meduza.io/en/news/2017/10/02/navalny-and-his-campaign-manager-are-locked-up-for-20-days-as-supporters-call-for-nationwide-protests-on-saturday-putin-s-birthday

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-kazan-elvira-dmitriyeva-navalny-campaign-head/28733610.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/22/world/europe/aleksei-navalny-foundation-russia.html

https://www.ft.com/content/512316f0-2666-11e7-8691-d5f7e0cd0a16

https://en.crimerussia.com/gromkie-dela/head-of-navalny-s-campaign-headquarters-arrested-for-10-days/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5395245/Russian-opposition-leaders-website-blocked.html

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/06/russia-bars-alexei-navalny-2018-presidential-bid-170624045154337.html

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-navalny-campaign-activist-attacked-pipe-moscow/28738107.html

https://meduza.io/en/feature/2017/07/05/the-new-nationwide-assault-on-alexey-navalny-s-presidential-campaign

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/02/world/europe/russia-aleksei-navalny-opposition.html?_r=0

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-03-28/inside-alexei-navalny-s-long-shot-bid-to-beat-putin

https://themoscowtimes.com/news/attackers-beat-navalny-campaigns-landlord-with-bats-in-siberia-58125?source=Snapzu

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russian-opposition-activists-blinded-acid-attacks-vladimir-putin-moscow-kremlin-alexei-navalny-a7712056.html

WESTERN PROPAGANDA

Offline Theodin

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2553 on: February 17, 2018, 07:16:11 pm »
Yea I don’t think Russia’s very politically free lol

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AeroNinja

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2554 on: February 17, 2018, 07:18:17 pm »
The General Russian Politics Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)

Offline Duuring

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2555 on: February 17, 2018, 07:23:36 pm »
New poll because why not?

New new poll because I just discovered UKIP kicked out their leader again.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 07:26:29 pm by Duuring »

Offline junedragon

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2556 on: February 17, 2018, 08:24:01 pm »

Quite frankly, I don't care about the UN declaring the vote invalid because I know how the people in Crimea voted and that's all that matters.

 Media is not tightly controlled at all, and people are free to do as they please. I know many people in Russia who are opposed to Putin, people who support Navalny etc. and nothing bad has happened to them. They're all living freely, nobody's harrassing them or oppressing them.

Russia is no longer the Soviet Union and is now a free democracy.



you're so blinded by the anti-Russian propaganda,


you're so blinded by propaganda,


so blinded by propaganda,

Look in a mirror
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Offline Toffee

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2557 on: February 17, 2018, 08:27:15 pm »
It's really quite ironic isn't it

Offline Conway

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2558 on: February 17, 2018, 09:04:43 pm »
I'm not going to claim that the west is moral, H Bush invade Iraq to secure oil and W Bush invaded to seem powerful in the wake of low popularity. The western countries invaded the Balkans (Half because they where committing genocide) and half to ensure they didn't slip back into Russia's grasp. JFK invaded the bay of pigs and LBJ sent troops to Vietnam to seem strong against communism.

I don't see why you feel like for some reason, an ex-KGB agent is doing everything for his "beloved Russia" rather than his personal gain. Some how Putin's salary is 1/8 the pay of my Prime Minister, yet Putin is one of the richest men in his country, funny that. He sent unmarked troops into Ukraine, not because they where coming close to slipping into NATO's sphere but ofc to protect a small Russian minority and to "protect the referendum in Crimea". He leveled Chechnya not because he wanted to seem strong, but because that little land locked state with naught more than militias where a major threat to Russia. And he invaded Georgia, not because they hurt his illegitimate satellite state, but because they attacked "U.N peacekeepers". Mikhail Khordokovsky just coincidentally breaks the law after he loses Putin's favour.

Offline junedragon

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2559 on: February 17, 2018, 09:46:44 pm »
I'm not going to claim that the west is moral

The thing is you dont have to.

If anyone believes election meddling doesnt exist and isnt reciprocal (for decades now), I have a bridge to sell you in scenic Iqaluit
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Offline Duuring

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2560 on: February 17, 2018, 09:58:24 pm »
Everybody knows the evil west wants nothing more then to weaken a country with a GDP per capita comparable to Greece. Putin just wants to make the economy strong so that all Russians can benefit from it!

Quote from: From Soviets to Oligarchs: Inequality and Property in Russia, 1905-2016
According to our benchmark estimates, top income shares are now similar to (or higher than) the levels observed in the United States. We also find that inequality has increased substantially more in Russia than in China and other ex-communist countries in Eastern Europe. We relate this finding to the specific transition strategy followed in Russia. According to our benchmark estimates, the wealth held offshore by rich Russians is about three times larger than official net foreign reserves, and is comparable in magnitude to total household financial assets held in Russia.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 10:01:28 pm by Duuring »

Offline Edwin

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2561 on: February 18, 2018, 08:37:39 pm »
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5402829/Homeless-man-dead-Westminster-child-abuser.html

Too funny not to share. (For non-Brits: this homeless guy died right outside parliament and was used as a cause célèbre against Tory austerity by Labour, including Corbyn himself.)

Offline MrTiki

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2562 on: February 19, 2018, 05:01:57 pm »
I'm not going to claim that the west is moral

The thing is you dont have to.

If anyone believes election meddling doesnt exist and isnt reciprocal (for decades now), I have a bridge to sell you in scenic Iqaluit
But it's like spying right? Everyone does it but the point is to not get caught. It's perfectly within a country's right to object to it happening, call them out on it and prosecute those offending, as it breaks the law. I'm pissed off enough at companies meddling in politics, let alone other countries.

Offline Prince_Eugen

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2563 on: February 20, 2018, 02:39:45 am »
Damn, i missed such a cool discussion about Crimea. Anyways, Russie stole Crimea from us in unlawful way, doesnt matter if it's historical their land. It belongs to Ukraine!

Btw, talking 'bout the poll for reunion with Russia in Crimea - i remember how the amount of voters reached higher than 110% Such enthusiasm, much legitimacy, Maths is ours.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 02:44:00 am by Prince_Eugen »

Offline junedragon

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Re: The General Political Thread - Brexit poll (#FSEXIT)
« Reply #2564 on: February 20, 2018, 07:21:59 am »
I'm not going to claim that the west is moral

The thing is you dont have to.

If anyone believes election meddling doesnt exist and isnt reciprocal (for decades now), I have a bridge to sell you in scenic Iqaluit
But it's like spying right? Everyone does it but the point is to not get caught. It's perfectly within a country's right to object to it happening, call them out on it and prosecute those offending, as it breaks the law. I'm pissed off enough at companies meddling in politics, let alone other countries.

Absolutely
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