The General Political Thread

[Cazasar]

It's estimated there are 23,000 Islamic extremists living in the UK.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/huge-scale-of-terror-threat-revealed-uk-home-to-23-000-jihadists-3zvn58mhq

To monitor someone 24/7 it takes at minimum 12 officers, and perhaps as many as 20. 12 x 23,000 would be 276,000 officers. It's plainly impossible to have that many people working for MI5 (even more so when you consider that at its height the East German Stasi had 91,000 personnel).

Hmm maybe you should have a British NSA 
Might help

Yes, more surveillance is the thing we need! Fuck rights of citizen, we need to protect them from the shit WE brought upon them! hahahahahahahahahahaIwannadiehahahahahahahaha

[Riddlez]

One guy was on a British TV program and was even confronted by counter-terrorism agents and still nothing happened. I doubt another agency would make a difference lol

They'd have convicted him if they could have. Perhaps not enough evidence?

[Edwin]

One guy was on a British TV program and was even confronted by counter-terrorism agents and still nothing happened. I doubt another agency would make a difference lol

They'd have convicted him if they could have. Perhaps not enough evidence?

There's more, though: the Moroccan-Italian was stopped trying to travel to Syria and was found with ISIS literature in his travel bag. He was placed on an Italian watch list and allowed back into the UK.

Did they really not have enough evidence that he may have been an extremist and take action?

[Karth]

lmao

[Riddlez]

One guy was on a British TV program and was even confronted by counter-terrorism agents and still nothing happened. I doubt another agency would make a difference lol

They'd have convicted him if they could have. Perhaps not enough evidence?

There's more, though: the Moroccan-Italian was stopped trying to travel to Syria and was found with ISIS literature in his travel bag. He was placed on an Italian watch list and allowed back into the UK.

Did they really not have enough evidence that he may have been an extremist and take action?

Being on a watchlist only means you're under scrutiny by police or the Intel agencies. It does nothing to your rights. If you aren't convincted, they can't stop you. If you're a European citizen, you can't be stopped from getting into the UK from Italy.

[Karth]

We jailed 100 Americans in guantanemo during our wars because of ties to extremists, just do the same

[Riddlez]

We jailed 100 Americans in guantanemo during our wars because of ties to extremists, just do the same

Yeah, but some regions of the world like to stick to humanitarian war law slightly more than others.

[William]

We jailed 100 Americans in guantanemo during our wars because of ties to extremists, just do the same

Yeah, but some regions of the world like to stick to humanitarian war law slightly more than others.

Last time I checked, only humans are subject to humanitarian war laws. Subhumans are not.

[Edwin]

We jailed 100 Americans in guantanemo during our wars because of ties to extremists, just do the same

I believe the Tories plan on paving a path to taking action against the extremists by going around the court of human rights in some way. That's of course assuming they win after tomorrow.

Human rights for people who do inhumane things... just don't add up dawg.

Edit: Sorry, that wasn't terribly specific - the Tories plan on "scrapping" any Human Right Laws that may obstruct action being taken against the extremists in the UK.

[StevenChilton]

Human rights are a waste of time and don't guarantee personal liberties. Rights granted to the masses from on high can just as easily be taken away again by the same authority, doesn't matter what a piece of paper says. Just look at Turkey, a member state of the ECHR.

Limited government has always been, and remains to this day, the best form of protection for personal freedoms. I bet a lot of Turks would gladly swap so-called 'human rights' for a few more limitations on Erdogan's powers.

[Jakester]

[Duuring]

Limited government has always been, and remains to this day, the best form of protection for personal freedoms.

Has it? Like how slavery and institutionalized racism went away all by itself over the last two centuries in the USA?

[StevenChilton]

Limited government has always been, and remains to this day, the best form of protection for personal freedoms.

Has it? Like how slavery and institutionalized racism went away all by itself over the last two centuries in the USA?

Not sure what your point is-for a start the US constitution originally protected the slave trade, and institutionalised racism is still rampant in the USA. You'll have to explain to me how it is that Turkey, an ECHR member state, is rapidly becoming an authoritarian dictatorship where personal freedoms are trampled. Erdogan couldn't have done any of that if Turkey had a tradition of limited government.

[Riddlez]

He could have, considering his power rise was mostly due to propaganda and letting his people 'choose' their dictator. He sued the means in place provided by the state mostly making use of military success. That would still have been possible with a limited government.

[StevenChilton]

He could have, considering his power rise was mostly due to propaganda and letting his people 'choose' their dictator. He sued the means in place provided by the state mostly making use of military success. That would still have been possible with a limited government.

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. You can't choose a dictator in a limited government because such a position could not exist. Look at the US-Trump is having all sorts of problems with the judiciary and Congress and can't do as he pleases (despite the fact he inherited a presidency from Obama that had massively increased its powers due to the abuse of executive orders).

Sure, you can change the system away from one of limited government but it's very, very difficult. Compare that to 'Human Rights' legislation where all you need is a clever lawyer or simply to activate the various suspension clauses within the legislation.