Developer Blog 18 - Napoleonic Wars Patch 1.104

[Vincenzo]

We do not only listen to the EU community, hell this was reported mostly by NA people, and most of all, I do not care who reports bugs or what nation their from, I care about fixing bugs.

This exploit is, an exploit... the weapon type switch is meant to switch a weapon to either melee or fire mode, not to make animations half-way through an attack appear differently..

We have not dumbed down melee as much as possible to annoy the pro's, the melee is hardly dumbed down, and works very well right now..


MM melee was just silly, all people had to do to block an attack is holding the down block or attack whilst turning 360 degrees in 0.2 seconds, there is no way you can convince me that was better..
the upper stab added 100% more killable option and made it more challenging for the pros.


In either case, nothing is going to be changed anymore, were too far into the release to change anything drastically...
And in my opinion, and this one is shared by many prominent figures in this community, the current system works well.

[kpetschulat]

I've honestly never heard of this double-x thing until it was brought up in the patch notes and people started bitching about it. I don't know why all of you, supporters and non-supports, can't just drop the God damn subject. Vince said it's gone, and it's going to stay gone.

What the fuck are you guys expecting now? For it to magically reappear in another patch, if one is even made? Don't mistake my attitude for anger, I'm just sick of this back and forth garbage over double-x which was so easy to block and counter. For fucks sake, I'm one of the better players in the community, and I don't need this stupid double-x "exploit/glitch/bug/style" to be it.

Sorry, but it's just a stupid subject, in my opinion. Many of you will disagree, especially the avid users of the double-x.

Also, on the subject of NA and EU respectively, stop this fucking community split NA vs. EU shit. It's not helping. Accusing each other of abusing or caressing the will of admins and developers doesn't help us at all. We're one big community, leave it at that. NW is slowly dieing out, and of all fucking times, the NA vs. EU tension has never been higher. We're still climbing to the top of this duel of continents or some shit, whatever you want to call it.

We do not only listen to the EU community, hell this was reported mostly by NA people, and most of all, I do not care who reports bugs or what nation their from, I care about fixing bugs.

This is what people fail to understand. And, this was my point above.

We have not dumbed down melee as much as possible to annoy the pro's, the melee is hardly dumbed down, and works very well right now..

MM melee was just silly, all people had to do to block an attack is holding the down block or attack whilst turning 360 degrees in 0.2 seconds, there is no way you can convince me that was better..
the upper stab added 100% more killable option and made it more challenging for the pros.


In either case, nothing is going to be changed anymore, were too far into the release to change anything drastically...
And in my opinion, and this one is shared by many prominent figures in this community, the current system works well.

I agree with Vince here. I loved Mount and Musket as much as the next guy, and was playing since MMPrussia. But, seriously. After coming to NW, and going back to MM for the lulz, how in the world can you people say that MM melee was so great? It was the most buggy, glitched, overrated garbage in any Warband mod I have played. I personally feel that NW is a massive improvement from MM, all around. Good melee, excellent quality uniforms, great mechanics, wonderful map, the ability to play on Dx9 without crashes... I just fail to see how people prefer the "MM Melee" now. I can barely play MM in melee, and once again, I was one of the better NA players.

[Fallout]

I'm afraid that the people who disagree with Vincenzo are just yelling at a wall. Vincenzo is the one writing on the paper, the people who would rather cry and yell exploit then try and actually understand what they're talking about are the paper suppliers and the people who actually understand the "exploit" are the people staring at the paper with nothing.

Dumb auto correct

[Coconut]

I didn't bring up MM to say that MM>NW in melee. My point was that when MM transitioned to NW they nerfed spinning, and when I say nerf they almost but completely made it useless in melee. They got rid or at least severely damaged a play-style. Now double x which I know a lot of peoples play styles are dependent on double x or at least use some aspect of it is now gone. Melee should not be just attack, block attack block attack block. Each fighter should have their own unique play-style and I want to recognize someone I know from my regiment from the way they fight.  What is next removal of chambering or kicking? I don't want to see NW reduced to two people dueling with no uniqueness to their fighting style. My point is with spinning and xx removed two play-styles have been destroyed and I am disappointed. Now all the playstyles that are left are feinters, chamberers, kickers and holders and frankly that is not enough.

[The Norseman]

What is done is done. I for one am happy. Didnt know spinning was removed though, I just saw one guy spin and take out 6 people so there must be something left. Im satisfied with the current system.

[kpetschulat]

I didn't bring up MM to say that MM>NW in melee. My point was that when MM transitioned to NW they nerfed spinning, and when I say nerf they almost but completely made it useless in melee. They got rid or at least severely damaged a play-style. Now double x which I know a lot of peoples play styles are dependent on double x or at least use some aspect of it is now gone. Melee should not be just attack, block attack block attack block. Each fighter should have their own unique play-style and I want to recognize someone I know from my regiment from the way they fight.  What is next removal of chambering or kicking? I don't want to see NW reduced to two people dueling with no uniqueness to their fighting style. My point is with spinning and xx removed two play-styles have been destroyed and I am disappointed. Now all the playstyles that are left are feinters, chamberers, kickers and holders and frankly that is not enough.

I love it how you guys keep on going on about what's going to get removed next. NOTHING IS GOING TO GET REMOVED NEXT. The double-x, according to a vast majority of the community, was an exploit, and Vincenzo did his job and listened to the community. He fixed an exploit that caused new players to not want to play and were leaving. Stop using the "what's next" argument. It's not going to work. Chambering and kicking are key parts of melee now, and ALWAYS have been. THe double-x and spinning shit wasn't needed to be a good melee player. I rarely used spinning, and I never knew of double-x, yet I managed to take down many players, even some greats, without the use of those two. All I do is block, kick, chamber, attack. I don't need anything, nor have I ever. In MM, the only thing I used was the jump-crouch-attack. That worked wonders, but guess what? It was an exploit too. It wasn't supposed to be there. That's why it was utterly removed, and the WFaS system of crouching was implemented into NW. It's a cleaner way of crouching.

Again, let's all drop this shit about double-x, move on, play the game, have fun... And, if not having double-x exploit to make you feel pro is gone, don't play. Save us the trouble of having to deal with you babies that use exploits to win in melee. You bitch and moan when you die, "my attack didn't work/lag/how did he kill me?" It's obvious, it was apparently easy to counter, and they killed you.

Idk, maybe some of us are not making ourselves clear, nor is Vincenzo when he says there will be no return of the double-x, etc. etc. etc., including no future patch for NW that is going to change NW melee drastically.

[Coconut]

Idk, maybe some of us are not making ourselves clear, nor is Vincenzo when he says there will be no return of the double-x, etc. etc. etc., including no future patch for NW that is going to change NW melee drastically.

NW melee has been changed twice drastically already. Once in beta when Hekko got FSE to implement aiming with the up attacks, they were locked into place back then. And second with the speed decrease on the up attack decreasing it by .15 seconds I believe? I don't see why FSE would not change the melee if they thought it was for the better for the entire community including pros, newbies, EU, NA, AU and everyone else not that it should matter where you come from or what your skill level is.

[Fallout]

I am just afraid for Napoleonic wars melee, I've had talks with my friends previously and chamfering and kicks aren't supposed to be allowed for melee, and if my memory serves me right if il not please correct me, but Vincenzo never intended for kicks and chambering to even happen.  I do know his stance on chambering is similar to double x'ing. But for now I will keep shut and play the game. Just please, stop changing the game. It's FINE.

[Vincenzo]

Idk, maybe some of us are not making ourselves clear, nor is Vincenzo when he says there will be no return of the double-x, etc. etc. etc., including no future patch for NW that is going to change NW melee drastically.

NW melee has been changed twice drastically already. Once in beta when Hekko got FSE to implement aiming with the up attacks, they were locked into place back then. And second with the speed decrease on the up attack decreasing it by .15 seconds I believe? I don't see why FSE would not change the melee if they thought it was for the better for the entire community including pros, newbies, EU, NA, AU and everyone else not that it should matter where you come from or what your skill level is.

The small changes we did to melee since release were all for the better, the up attack was changed to make it a bit more realistic, it takes 0.15 seconds longer to raise the weapon above your head, which makes it look a lot more realistically (try raising a musket above your head in real life). Naming this DRASTICAL is just silly.
It was changed for the better for the entire community, any region, and not to annoy you.

I am just afraid for Napoleonic wars melee, I've had talks with my friends previously and chamfering and kicks aren't supposed to be allowed for melee, and if my memory serves me right if il not please correct me, but Vincenzo never intended for kicks and chambering to even happen.  I do know his stance on chambering is similar to double x'ing. But for now I will keep shut and play the game. Just please, stop changing the game. It's FINE.

Wuuuuuut? 

Ofcource chambers and kicks are intended for melee...   

[MaHuD]

To all of you that claim to have played this for XXXXXXXXXXXX thousand hours and in addition claim that the double X was not an exploit: shut up will ya.

This bug / exploit  is originating from native and has been around for a very long time, if you haven't even detected or noticed that the animation was not displayed properly then quite frankly; you lack the intelligence to even be allowed to have an opinion.

[Coconut]

To all of you that claim to have played this for XXXXXXXXXXXX thousand hours and in addition claim that the double X was not an exploit: shut up will ya.

This bug / exploit  is originating from native and has been around for a very long time, if you haven't even detected or noticed that the animation was not displayed properly then quite frankly; you lack the intelligence to even be allowed to have an opinion.

Everyone knows that, and everyone knows that argument against xx as well. However I welcome this exploit as a part of the game and I recognize that it is not some overpowered exploit that is a win button. A lot of video games have exploits that are recognized in their competitive fields.

For example in the game GunZ: The Duel which is a melee/shooting game there is Fighting styles that revolve around exploits in the game engine. Here is a link to the wiki of a style called K-Style http://gunz.wikia.com/wiki/K-Style
This style involves jumping and dashing in a very complicated key motion that takes hours of practice to get down. The article says that approximately 45% of the Gunz players know how to execute a double butterfly. So that is 45% of the playerbase knows how to do a complicated exploit that makes them deal damage faster. If I recall a double butterfly was a way to deal two sword slashes in the time 1 regular one could be done by doing a series of weapon switches and dashes.

I don't see why double x should be removed from NW as it wasn't an overpowered attack that made you god. It was a fancy feint that only kills people that don't expect it. It was a completely legitimate fighting style that added depth to the melee in NW.


EDIT:
A quote from the article as well
While K-Styling has become a widely accepted mode of playing, it has often come under attack as being exploitative of glitches (a true statement) and thus against the rules or morally unacceptable. It is also worth noting that in the incipient months after the release of GunZ, developers did in fact "fix" K-Style in an extremely unpopular patch. However, seeing the reaction this provoked, the patch was rescinded and K-Style was left intact.

As you can see the Devs removed a popular exploit, people got pissed and complained and then they brought it back because it was an unpopular patch. The K-Style required a lot of practice to get down the muscle memory of the key combinations but with enough time and practice everyone could do it. EVERYONE CAN DO XX as well in NW and its not even some overpowered style compared to K-Style in this GunZ game.

[Riddlez]

It's not as if FSE or Taleworlds are oing to change it back, so why all the bitching:

This is one of those typical things where the best way of going about it is:

Shrug, be disappointed, but for the sake of the mental stability of the people here: Shut up about it.

You're allowed to be disappointed, but please keep it to yourself, or just admit it's a shame.
The community has had enough bitching of late, let's not get ample more.

[DrByeBYe]

#DoubleX4lyfe

[Millander]

As somebody who owns a Musket and bayonet I tried to DoubleX in my backyard. It does not work.

[Desert Thunda]

Shooting.