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The Lounge => Historical Discussion => Topic started by: Augy on August 03, 2014, 04:03:07 pm

Title: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 03, 2014, 04:03:07 pm
In 1919, Britain came close to a workers’ and soldiers’ uprising. But it’s not a story the official WW1 commemoration wants to highlight

More here (https://libcom.org/tags/world-war-1).
The truth behind Britain’s rush to war, 1914 - Douglas Newton (https://libcom.org/history/darkest-days-truth-behind-britain%E2%80%99s-rush-war-1914-douglas-newton)
A German deserter's war experiences (https://libcom.org/history/german-deserters-war-experiences)
A people's history of World War I - Howard Zinn (https://libcom.org/history/peoples-history-world-war-i-howard-zinn)
1918-1930: Mutiny and resistance in the Royal Navy (https://libcom.org/history/1918-1930-mutiny-and-resistance-in-the-royal-navy)
Anarchists before the military tribunals, 1914-1918 (https://libcom.org/history/anarchists-military-tribunals-1914-1918)
Why Blackadder Goes Forth could have been a lot funnier  (https://libcom.org/history/why-blackadder-goes-forth%E2%80%99-could-have-been-lot-funnier)
1917: The Etaples mutiny (http://libcom.org/history/articles/etaples-mutiny-1917/)- A short history of one of the early big mutinies of British troops in Europe as World War I came to an end.
Did teenage anarchists trigger World War I? What were the politics of the assassins of Franz Ferdinand on 28 June 1914? (https://libcom.org/history/did-teenage-anarchists-trigger-world-war-one-what-was-politics-assassins-franz-ferdinand)
The Origins of Nationalism in the Proletariat (https://libcom.org/library/origins-nationalism-proletariat)
World War I - further reading guide (https://libcom.org/library/world-war-i-further-reading-guide)

some facts I like to drop:

WWII also could've have been stopped by the West before it even started. Going back decades, the United States and Japan had been pushing one another on who would control the Pacific for trading routes and oil. So Japan had been on the ups since 1931 with the invasion of Manchuria (for an anarchist perspective, look into the Shinmin Autonomous Region which was crushed by 31-32; we're talking huge confederation of autonomous villages), push its way against the Soviet Union, China, Indochina (controlled by the French), and Pacific islands.

The United States had ruled the Phillipines since 1900 or so, and they didn't exactly ask nicely. United States fears for its own colonies, embargoes Japan of oil, they get pissed and bring the US into World War II. And while the United States focuses on events like the Batan death-march, they turn around and indiscriminately murder 100,000 Tokyo civilians in a single night. (Movie to fuck you up about that: Grave of the Fireflies). Japan and United States was not about peace, it was about who was the biggest dick on the playground.

Now to Europe, everyone basically knows the west tore Germany a new asshole, forcing it into terrible conditions, causing all sorts of fucked up reactions to ideological extremes, and the west liked fascists more than communists. Had the west not stood aside in the face of fascism, instead of propping up the corporations/companies as they did, Europe may have come away with a different fate.

Everyone was very much in the throes of a fight against communism, so prop up every other douchebag and his friends across the world to stop what may be happening within your own borders. So the United States holds a better resource advantage in supporting Britain, aside from being ideological supporters, and starts giving them weapons well before the war starts, of course a territorial issue between European nations would drag in their supporters across the globe as well. And if you look at all into the history of the Nuremburg trials, a number of Nazis got off of their crimes, like submarine captains, who were going around blowing up civilian and freight ships, because the west was doing the same. Then tie that to the outright destruction of places like Dresden with 25k civilians dead. Following the war, the west also arbitrarily chopped up the Middle East for its oil revenues. US gets Saudi Arabia, Britain gets Iran, and they split what's in the middle (I forget the name of the treaty that was).
What separated it though, was that no one was ready for the absolute slaughter the fascists had taken about across Europe, which dwarfed the American brutality.

I also did a lot of research study into the American Civil War that I can get into but it's sunday, I have friends to be drunk, and alcohol to be met.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 03, 2014, 04:08:08 pm
Next on Augy's Anarchist Ramblings: Why the American Civil War was actually an Anarchist rebellion. Stay tuned.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Archduke Sven on August 03, 2014, 04:32:12 pm
augy stahp bein so spooky
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Rival on August 03, 2014, 04:33:08 pm
2spooky5me
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Turin Turambar on August 03, 2014, 07:40:02 pm
Who read "The Sleepwalkers"?
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Colonel Howe on August 04, 2014, 01:21:41 am
Augy pls rename this Augy's Anarchist Workshop

Thanks :3
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Shredder on August 04, 2014, 01:38:28 am
Augy, are you a Stephan Molyneux listener? just curious.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 04, 2014, 01:51:07 am
Quote from: Shredder on August 04, 2014, 01:38:28 am
Augy, are you a Stephan Molyneux listener? just curious.

Stefan Molyneux makes my stomach turn.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Archduke Sven on August 04, 2014, 03:01:26 am
augy is 3sp00ky5me guis
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Russian on August 04, 2014, 08:42:59 am
Disregard, I misread the thread.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 04, 2014, 10:02:11 am
It's been a century since World War I when the forces of nationalism and jingoism conspired to put good men to their graves. Horrible I know, but some solace I get out of reading about it is that people don't inherently want to kill each other.

Has anyone heard of "live and let live"? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_and_let_live_%28World_War_I%29

It was the idea that people on both sides of the trenches actively avoided killing each other. I mean this was after they had a rifle shoved in their hands and told that the devil is over there just said "no ta" and sort of stood around looking busy.

There's stories of artillery teams avoiding shooting the trenches and when they accidently did they just yelled over saying something on the lines of "The artillery's shit, sorry didn't mean it". Hell I've heard stories of some Germans crossing the lines every dinner time to come eat our food because he thought it was better. On Christmas day in one particular stretch of the trenches the guys on each side played football with each other.

This wasn't just an isolated incident and it shows me that people aren't evil, just old men who detract themselves of the situation and don't have to do any of the dirty work themselves. I just think this is quite important to keep in mind, especially at the moment with the troubles that there is these days a valid response the authority that is telling you "that man is evil and you should kill him" is to tell him "Fuck off" and go play football with the other dude.

Remember the fallen, fuck the authorities that made them fall.

Quote from: Archduke Sven on August 04, 2014, 03:01:26 am
augy is 3sp00ky5me guis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N65YKRVCtYQ

Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: EdwardC on August 04, 2014, 10:12:02 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fboHP2RvkLY
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Humlenerd on August 05, 2014, 07:18:25 pm
Read "War is a Racket", Augy  ;)
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 05, 2014, 07:53:45 pm
Thanks for reminding me, Humblenerd! Smedley Butler had an interesting life in the marine corps fo sho, his experience with the Bonus Army and alleged part in the "Business plot". Definately gonna read it, i think Europeans generally know more about american history than vice versa.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Archduke Sven on August 05, 2014, 09:20:19 pm
War and Peace best WW1 book ever.

and augy, you're a brigadier general, you're a sick authority
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Madbull on August 05, 2014, 09:38:09 pm
Truth is

Spoiler
illominati started ww1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTiksvP3APw
[close]
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 05, 2014, 10:13:47 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/ijQEp.jpg)
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: ClearlyInvsible on August 05, 2014, 10:15:22 pm
Did you really just make a Homestuck reference? REALLY?
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 05, 2014, 10:22:18 pm
Quote from: ClearlyInvsible on August 05, 2014, 10:15:22 pm
Did you really just make a Homestuck reference? REALLY?

It is what it is, REALLY!!!

Spoiler
(https://i.imgur.com/YrXyI.jpg)
[close]
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: ClearlyInvsible on August 05, 2014, 10:23:10 pm
Ugh, more Anarcho-Communist stuff. Give me a second I need to call the CNT.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 05, 2014, 10:27:38 pm
The CNT-FAI is a great organisation, its sad they couldnt do more fore Marocco during the Spanish Civil War... if i was present there, i would stir up anti-colonial and imperial sentiments in spanish marocco.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 05, 2014, 10:39:22 pm
All this anti-imperialism  :'(

Australia Pre-Colony
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.janesoceania.com%2Faustralia_home%2Faust5.jpg&hash=c950dbc885ffb784a00bed923bb5fd1f45f004ab)
[close]

Australia Now
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fe%2Fee%2FBrisbane_CBDandSB.jpg&hash=0c0c28d018ed992401c1907276f2116b9bc083f4)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fkandelconsultant.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F03%2FMelbourne_thumb.png&hash=3d6d55fd5da9dc19fd4eaa7eafd71a1893dfc1ac)
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Spoiler
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zps13844f3d.png&hash=4bbd1ffc2534e33385835fc134dfe1175690f5e5)
[close]
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 05, 2014, 10:48:47 pm
Like the United States, they genocided the native population or put them into reservations.... i suggest you don't dig yourself a deeper hole defending this.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 05, 2014, 10:57:05 pm
America Then
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwallpaperus.org%2Fwallpapers%2F02%2F8%2Fnative-americans-2560x1600-wallpaper-636045.jpg&hash=0e3f0b0e187b03b615d14e7c0ef0cb2aed80936a)
[close]
America Now
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zps51c28999.png&hash=a1acd019a242dc70f737ac608b87e083b9ee60d3)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zpsc34f9913.png&hash=b8a136be9d96a9c82912b9fd5eddf8dbb987a14a)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.topuniversities.com%2Fsites%2Fqs.topuni%2Ffiles%2Ffilefields%2Ffield_article_image%2FTop_10_Universities_in_New_York_City.jpg&hash=a95c23a521673502066b3e89dd932db24229c3c4)
[close]
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 05, 2014, 11:00:42 pm
Spoiler
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zps51c28999.png&hash=a1acd019a242dc70f737ac608b87e083b9ee60d3)
[close]

NETHERLANDS BEATS USA! WOOOOOOOOOH!
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 06, 2014, 05:29:09 pm
America: white bourgeois slave owners in a boat kill you in your sleep on Christmas!
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.zerohedge.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fimages%2Fuser3303%2Fimageroot%2F2014%2F08%2F20140805_war.jpg&hash=46b924e867fc784ed049b21834627f58cf3bf006)

Spoiler
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUig0lFHDDw&list=FL1bwcOpu_q-HqbPypsvuDsA&index=445
[close]
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 06:01:27 pm
Pretty sure that picture is used by those fanatic anti-Everything 'Muricans who think Washington was a demi-god whose memory should lead them in the fight against evul Obama.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 06, 2014, 09:01:45 pm
You're right Augy. I'm sick of my needs being provided for by my government and would much rather have to fend for myself against disease and famine and murderers and rapists. God how could I have been so stupid before?
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 06, 2014, 09:12:22 pm
you're misinformed, my friend.
Title: What the fuck is this yo
Post by: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 09:29:55 pm
What's even the purpose of this thread?
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Turin Turambar on August 06, 2014, 09:35:15 pm
Quote from: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 09:29:55 pm
What's even the purpose of this thread?
Maybe we could start telling each other that the others had the fault of WW1.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 09:38:07 pm
I can smell a post of Augy coming in, describing how the evil capitalist people in power started WW1 just to have a little fun.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 06, 2014, 10:21:53 pm
Quote from: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 09:38:07 pm
I can smell a post of Augy coming in, describing how the evil capitalist people in power started WW1 just to have a little fun.

Okay troll, i'll feed you. The Great War was a crime against humanity committed by the competing imperialist states in the interests of local capital, and the millions of people forced into slavery and combat had no interest served by it. It was simply pointless for the working-class people who fought and sustained the war. That's why it was necessary to create a huge propaganda machine for blind jingoism, whose memes survive a century later. Being on the losing side of the war was nothing to fear: any vindictive measures imposed by the victors would simply be experienced as a fractional increase in the industrial exploitation they were already subject to from their own nation's ruling class, which they already knew perfectly well how to struggle against (especially in Russia and Germany).

This isn't about hippie non-violence, it's about active resistance to militarism. The war only ended when it did because the belligerents ran out of steam, and this only happened because crucial sectors of their industrial base and military apparatus rose a red flag and refused to contribute to the war effort. The obedient soldiers and workers who sacrificed their lives and freedom for their fatherland achieved nothing but their own deaths and the enslavement of their fellows; the revolutionaries who sabotaged their own state's home front (sometimes with covert aid from the enemy government) were the heroes who saved their people from the total war caused by unfettered imperialist capitalism.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Hawke on August 06, 2014, 11:04:36 pm
Maybe you should rename the thread to 'Augy's Propaganda Board' and start making posters?
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 06, 2014, 11:35:09 pm
I love the claim of artillerymen who would shout sorry if they hit the enemy, while artillery targets would be nearly out of their sight, let alone shouting distance.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 07, 2014, 12:21:27 am
I heard Osama Bin Laden was still alive.

And did anyone notice the connection?

Obama/Biden
Osama Bin Laden
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Duuring on August 07, 2014, 12:22:28 am
Quote from: USE4life on August 07, 2014, 12:21:27 am
I heard Osama Bin Laden was still alive.

And did anyone notice the connection?

Obama/Biden
Osama Bin Laden

+1111
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Von_Clausewitz on August 07, 2014, 12:41:56 am
This thread is cancer. Also; Great job at commemorating WW1
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Hawke on August 07, 2014, 01:09:27 am
It's the government, I tell you!
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 07, 2014, 01:29:00 am
Quote from: Von_Clausewitz on August 07, 2014, 12:41:56 am
This thread is cancer. Also; Great job at commemorating WW1

The Government invented cancer to keep the working class in their place and to empower the the elite.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Madbull on August 07, 2014, 02:01:19 am
Every US made war movie was nothing more than propaganda funded by the government to increase enlistment.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 07, 2014, 07:25:56 am
WW1 ended in working class revolt. Socialists combined with Social Democrats to pressure the Kaiser to abdicate, among the social democrats was the kaiser's own son.
The problem with the way the war ended? The newly formed republic was unable to negotiate decent terms with the allies, a combination of capitalist and monarchist forces that exploited Germany to the point of a second revolution.
This one done by angry reactionary nationalists aka the Nazi's
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 07, 2014, 11:09:45 am
The British empire also had major turmoil: http://leftfootforward.org/2014/08/ww1-the-hidden-story-of-soliders-mutinies-strikes-and-riots/
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 09, 2014, 11:19:13 am
Site called "LeftFoorForward", many credibility much neutral.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Von_Clausewitz on August 09, 2014, 12:07:58 pm
Quote from: USE4life on August 09, 2014, 11:19:13 am
Site called "LeftFoorForward", many credibility much neutral.

This.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:20:11 pm
Indeed, its not neutral but that doesnt mean they can have good arguments.
This is simply a cop-out so you are ignored. You guys would be totally fine if your views are espoused in the media so i find this ironic aswel.

get on-topic or fuck off  :)
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Von_Clausewitz on August 09, 2014, 12:30:42 pm
Quote from: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:20:11 pm
Indeed, its not neutral but that doesnt mean they can have good arguments.
This is simply a cop-out so you are ignored. You guys would be totally fine if your views are espoused in the media so i find this ironic aswel.

get on-topic or fuck off  :)

If the source is not neutral their arguments won't be neutral therefore it's biased bullshit. And why would any history nut want biased information? I want a neutral source of information and not some leftist articles. So do yourself a favor and let this thread die because it's nothing more than a big rant on why your views upon the subject are right and everyone that opposes that is wrong and a facist liar.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:39:46 pm
I fucking get it, you're butthurt that theres left libertarian representation on here. please fuck off. Go jerk off to some war memorobilia and stay out of here because you don't belong.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Von_Clausewitz on August 09, 2014, 12:44:01 pm
Quote from: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:39:46 pm
I fucking get it, you're butthurt that theres left libertarian representation on here. please fuck off. Go jerk off to some war memorobilia and stay out of here because you don't belong.

So tell me, who does belong in this thread if it's not people who want neutral representation of history? Basically it comes down to you wanting a massive circlejerk in this thread. Well done mate.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:51:44 pm
History is written by the victors. You choose to ignore the common people's history and pick the side of the States written history. Don't get mad when someone doesnt accept the mainstream view and digs deeper.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 10, 2014, 12:17:10 am
Quote from: Augy on August 09, 2014, 12:51:44 pm
History is written by the victors. You choose to ignore the common people's history and pick the side of the States written history. Don't get mad when someone doesnt accept the mainstream view and digs deeper.

I hope you don't breed.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:00:53 am
Quote from: USE4life on August 05, 2014, 10:57:05 pm
America Then
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwallpaperus.org%2Fwallpapers%2F02%2F8%2Fnative-americans-2560x1600-wallpaper-636045.jpg&hash=0e3f0b0e187b03b615d14e7c0ef0cb2aed80936a)
[close]
America Now
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zps51c28999.png&hash=a1acd019a242dc70f737ac608b87e083b9ee60d3)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1062.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft486%2FUSE4life%2FUntitled_zpsc34f9913.png&hash=b8a136be9d96a9c82912b9fd5eddf8dbb987a14a)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.topuniversities.com%2Fsites%2Fqs.topuni%2Ffiles%2Ffilefields%2Ffield_article_image%2FTop_10_Universities_in_New_York_City.jpg&hash=a95c23a521673502066b3e89dd932db24229c3c4)
[close]

This has to be a joke
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 10, 2014, 10:31:08 am
It is a joke but he can't help it. Conquest isn't just bullets and bombs. Conquest is cultural too. That's why the descendants of slaves in the US are mostly christian and why people in Dublin speak English.

The murder and genocide of the numerous American Indian nations was a tragedy, but the destruction of their cultures is a different kind of tragedy. Americanization/Europeanisation/Gentrification etc is a kind of conquest in itself.

Gramsci called this concept 'cultural hegemony':
"Hegemony' in this case means the success of the dominant classes in presenting their definition of reality, their view of the world, in such a way that it is accepted by other classes as 'common sense". The general 'consensus' is that it is the only sensible way of seeing the world.

The American government actively killed Native Americans for one hundred years and more. I think what the U.S. government did the Native Americans is just as bad, and worse than what happened to Jews in Nazi Germany. And I think it's all awful and evil. But it was all for capitalism and the state so we can "move on" so its fine, made a lot of money from buying their cheap land by expelling them and then speculating on the land. Railroads had to be built by small groups of rich white men.

America was built by immigrants from all over the world, Blacks, Women, Native Americans, Chinese you name it but only a select few profited of it. The American Nightmare.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
Yeah, the worst part is that we don't really talk about it in school, and when we do it's usually pretty pro-white biased and disgusting. I remember my textbook was taking the side of the American soldiers at the Massacre at Wounded knee. The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America has done, yet we don't attempt to learn from it.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 10, 2014, 11:47:23 am
'Peoples history of the United States' by Howard Zinn really opened my eyes to their plight.
http://www.thegoyslife.com/Documents/Books/A%20People%27s%20History%20of%20the%20United%20States-%20Howard%20Zinn.pdf

It goes over pretty much all over US history, most indepth stuff but theres a bias towards the lower class. But its well researched.


Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: USE4life on August 10, 2014, 05:24:06 pm
Quote from: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America,  yet we don't attempt to learn from it.

Spoiler
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos1.blogger.com%2Fx%2Fblogger%2F7114%2F258%2F400%2F422707%2Fhiroshima-damage.jpg&hash=6cf54f7aff063964a61ea65004aa195587f2d7ef)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.exploratorium.edu%2Fnagasaki%2Fjourney%2F07.jpg&hash=3750c9a5643e8d3e21d36c4969d92372db9e4ed5)
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fd%2Fd4%2FGeorge-W-Bush.jpeg&hash=e7345e4d6a89f2a37b5cd2427f4d78de7f6fae3f)
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Yeah I think that's a common theme with you chaps.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Colonel Howe on August 10, 2014, 06:17:47 pm
Quote from: USE4life on August 10, 2014, 05:24:06 pm
Quote from: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America,  yet we don't attempt to learn from it.

Spoiler
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.exploratorium.edu%2Fnagasaki%2Fjourney%2F07.jpg&hash=3750c9a5643e8d3e21d36c4969d92372db9e4ed5)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcoffeeticks.my%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F07%2Fnagasaki-explosion.jpg&hash=08084310bd51abbd5e0970bcef15a3af227962be)
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fd%2Fd4%2FGeorge-W-Bush.jpeg&hash=e7345e4d6a89f2a37b5cd2427f4d78de7f6fae3f)
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Yeah I think that's a common theme with you chaps.
Hiroshima was different. That bomb freedomized them. And Bush is the greatest liberator in human history. A Caesar of the Middle East and Grand Freedomer of Ze Oil
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Walko on August 10, 2014, 07:09:42 pm
Quote from: USE4life on August 10, 2014, 05:24:06 pm
Quote from: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America,  yet we don't attempt to learn from it.

Spoiler
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos1.blogger.com%2Fx%2Fblogger%2F7114%2F258%2F400%2F422707%2Fhiroshima-damage.jpg&hash=6cf54f7aff063964a61ea65004aa195587f2d7ef)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.exploratorium.edu%2Fnagasaki%2Fjourney%2F07.jpg&hash=3750c9a5643e8d3e21d36c4969d92372db9e4ed5)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcoffeeticks.my%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F07%2Fnagasaki-explosion.jpg&hash=08084310bd51abbd5e0970bcef15a3af227962be)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.foreignpolicy.com%2Ffiles%2Ffp_uploaded_images%2F111215_iraq1resized.jpg&hash=f1fe8883e97e36b0b9a92966e828d41ac984c210)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fd%2Fd4%2FGeorge-W-Bush.jpeg&hash=e7345e4d6a89f2a37b5cd2427f4d78de7f6fae3f)
(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww3.imperial.ac.uk%2Fnewseventsimages%3Fp_image_type%3Dmainnews2012%26amp%3Bp_image_id%3D19510&hash=59f65b4c856e2ef99f22ff00e187241c911f418c)
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Yeah I think that's a common theme with you chaps.

Yeah, I'm not saying America hasn't done bad things, it has. But I am more than willing to debate the ethical decision of the atomic bomb.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 10, 2014, 07:22:20 pm
Not many people know that Japan was almost completely firebombed, they chose Nagasaki and Hiroshima because they were well-populated and they wanted to see what the effects were... its totally fucked up.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Walko on August 11, 2014, 12:56:28 am
It was the less of two evils
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Archduke Sven on August 11, 2014, 01:38:30 am
Quote from: everyone except augy on August 09, 2014, 12:39:46 pm
I fucking get it, you're butthurt that there isn't enough extreme left representation on here. please fuck off. Go jerk off to some anarchist today pamphlets and stay here on this thread because you don't belong anywhere else.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Nipplestockings on August 11, 2014, 01:43:14 am
Quote from: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
Yeah, the worst part is that we don't really talk about it in school, and when we do it's usually pretty pro-white biased and disgusting. I remember my textbook was taking the side of the American soldiers at the Massacre at Wounded knee. The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America has done, yet we don't attempt to learn from it.

Really? In my school history was 100% minority apologist white hating bs. Almost every single lesson revolved around how white people are scum of the earth and we killed all the poor baby native americans/blacks/asians/hispanics. I thought it was pretty disgusting, so I guess we agree there. Pro white bias is just as bad, but it certainly shouldn't be ANTI-white. It might be even worse actually. We're being taught to hate ourselves and our history.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Walko on August 11, 2014, 02:48:50 am
Quote from: Nipplestockings on August 11, 2014, 01:43:14 am
Quote from: Walko on August 10, 2014, 10:39:45 am
Yeah, the worst part is that we don't really talk about it in school, and when we do it's usually pretty pro-white biased and disgusting. I remember my textbook was taking the side of the American soldiers at the Massacre at Wounded knee. The slaughter of the native Americans is a huge fucking tragedy, and probably the absolute worst thing America has done, yet we don't attempt to learn from it.

Really? In my school history was 100% minority apologist white hating bs. Almost every single lesson revolved around how white people are scum of the earth and we killed all the poor baby native americans/blacks/asians/hispanics. I thought it was pretty disgusting, so I guess we agree there. Pro white bias is just as bad, but it certainly shouldn't be ANTI-white. It might be even worse actually. We're being taught to hate ourselves and our history.

Yeah I've heard both stories (overly pro white, and overly pro native taught it school), I guess it really depends on the teacher, and to be honest white people did do a lot of fucked up shit. I agree though there is no point beating ourselves up about it, but we should remember to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Riddlez on August 11, 2014, 02:55:07 pm
Augy, you've reached the point I don't even want to argue with you about this.

And that means something.
You seem obsessed with anarchy. That's not a problem on itself, the point is, is that you haven't even a basic understanding of how to have a proper discussion.

You never used sources. I correct. Now you have 8 or so. Seems good from a distant, only that it is from the SAME FUCKING website.
That lowers the number of sources from an apparent 8, to 1.
Also, the fact you nearly never seem to be posting objective sources, is a grand hilarity on itself, which makes your number of sources dwindle to 0. Seriously, the one single proper source I have ever seen you post was that philosophical article where the writer couldn't even get his -isms correctly.

How can you ever suspect being taken seriously?

You have, everytime you say something, just call 'argument invalid' and one would be correct as well.
The amount of fallacies are literally hilarious. I did nothing but have a wide grin on my face while reading through some articles.


You're not even aware of this all yourself.

To become the slightest bit more skilled about it, have a look at this.
(This is RIddlez doing you a favour, pay close fucking attention)

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Title: Re: WW1 commemoration from a class angle, fuck nationalism.
Post by: Augy on August 11, 2014, 03:18:32 pm
This is getting tiring. I claim superiority!