Let's discuss: Reenacting!

[zac]

Flags are so annoying. Everybody insists on getting one, on always carrying it, and they never do it correctly, impression nor position in a formation.We are never getting one for our napoleonic impression.

Apparantly the Dutch 85e wants to make pikes to make new unarmed members colour guards. I hope it's not true, but if it is, how about you just try to re-enact a normal platoon of line soldiers correctly before you start looking for 'additions'.

lol...the australian 21e set up those same pike colour guard guys about 3 years ago for that very same reason.........

[Duuring]

Ugghh why is it so difficult for mainstream units just to say 'no' once in a while.

[Riddlez]

Because the 'leaders' aren't actually leaders. Just people who know how to play soldier a little better than the rest.

[joer5835]

Anybody here happen to have a good English translation of the Bardin uniform regulations? I feel my competence in French should be enough to get through it eventually but it'd be nice to have a version that doesn't require me to focus so much in order to read it and not accidentally miss small details.

[Duuring]

Because the 'leaders' aren't actually leaders. Just people who know how to play soldier a little better than the rest.

Seems an accurate description of our group.

[Olafson]

Because the 'leaders' aren't actually leaders. Just people who know how to play soldier a little better than the rest.

That has nothing to do with Mainstream reenactors not being able to say no to retarded stuff like pike guards.  Reenactment is just like minded people coming together, democratically deciding on what to do.
And likeminded people can go both ways. There are people that generally agree to all those weird ideas because they either do not know better or do not care, and they ususally get together and group up. And then there are people that do not want that kind of stuff, and they also group up.

So you will end up with different groups, all with slightly(Or not major..)differences in their opinion on how to reenact.

And that is a good thing. If everyone was forced into a unit with a leader they do not know or like and would be forced to wear and do what he says, they would basically be in the real army. A few people would like the leader, but the majority would probably dislike him, and eventually he would end up "accidentially" getting shot in the back.

This is exactly what happened back in the day, and you probably do not want to repeat that. I understand that you need this in the real army and it makes perfect sense to do so, but for a hobby it makes no sense. You group up together with like-minded people and work together with them because you are doing this for fun. And being together with people that you do not like is not fun.

But this also explains why Mainstream groups generally can not say "no" to those ideas. There is no one in the group that could potentially be against it. Everyone thinks the same and has the same opinion about how to do stuff.

Anybody here happen to have a good English translation of the Bardin uniform regulations? I feel my competence in French should be enough to get through it eventually but it'd be nice to have a version that doesn't require me to focus so much in order to read it and not accidentally miss small details.

I have never heard about that, I would be interested in it myself. Since I am assuming that you are reading it for your 85e impression, remember that what is written in the regulations and what the regiment/soldier actually had is sometimes very different. So take the regulations as base for everything, but then apply your regiment/timeframe/soldier specific modifications to it.

Because the 'leaders' aren't actually leaders. Just people who know how to play soldier a little better than the rest.

Seems an accurate description of our group.

Or reenactment in general? I mean it is a big pretend game anyway.

[Cara]

Anybody here happen to have a good English translation of the Bardin uniform regulations? I feel my competence in French should be enough to get through it eventually but it'd be nice to have a version that doesn't require me to focus so much in order to read it and not accidentally miss small details.

I have never heard about that, I would be interested in it myself. Since I am assuming that you are reading it for your 85e impression, remember that what is written in the regulations and what the regiment/soldier actually had is sometimes very different. So take the regulations as base for everything, but then apply your regiment/timeframe/soldier specific modifications to it.

I would take it to Marc, considering his "Living History Charter" and stuff, he probably did one. or at least a bit.

[Riddlez]

Olaf you misunderstand what I meant.
I do not mean there is 1 person dictates what everyone has to do exactly, but the leader of the group has to decide on the direction of the group, for the good of the group. Without dictating individual choices, it is the leader(s) of the group who decide what the group facilitaties,for non-firing members.

Leaderahip in that sense to me isn't a leader bding to person to decide what everyone does. Thats not a style of leadership, thats a style of management.
In this case, it should be the leader deciding the direction of the group: not the individual direction.

What annoys me is that nodoby seems willing to say "No, that is not a good idea, bad for the grouo impression and not how we should do it" well they do, sometimes, but then refuse to act upon it and carry out that opinion. In a leadership position, even in a hobby-re-enactment environment, that is acting spineless. It doesnt work at all on the long run.

[Vincenzo]

Anybody here happen to have a good English translation of the Bardin uniform regulations? I feel my competence in French should be enough to get through it eventually but it'd be nice to have a version that doesn't require me to focus so much in order to read it and not accidentally miss small details.

There is this shit on the old 85eme website:
https://www.fsegames.eu/85emeold/historyuk.html

(Part 1: Uniform and equipment
Part 2: Tenues
Part 3: A fusilier's kit)

No idea how accurate it is.

[Duuring]

Olaf you misunderstand what I meant.
I do not mean there is 1 person dictates what everyone has to do exactly, but the leader of the group has to decide on the direction of the group, for the good of the group. Without dictating individual choices, it is the leader(s) of the group who decide what the group facilitaties,for non-firing members.

But allowing an abundance of different impressions doesn't necessarily mean a lack of spine by the leader (or club). As Olafson said, some genuinely do not care. And when they do, these clubs are still democratic and you can't ignore the wishes of your members.

What annoys me is that nodoby seems willing to say "No, that is not a good idea, bad for the grouo impression and not how we should do it" well they do, sometimes, but then refuse to act upon it and carry out that opinion. In a leadership position, even in a hobby-re-enactment environment, that is acting spineless. It doesnt work at all on the long run.

Very much agreed. But that's the thing; a certain kind of group culture appeals to a certain kind of people. The whole goal of our progressive group is that we only appeal to people with a progressive mind. It's much easier to convince people with that kind of mindset that the decision to do only one impression (that of a fusilier company) is really the best one. Groups will do everything do get more people into their unit, not understanding that this is what, as you said, kills them in the long run. Actually, someone at Waterloo asked us if the Dutch 85e is still a thing. To be fair, it still is, but it shows its reputation.

It's really weird once you think about it; The state of the French groups in the Netherlands is abysmal. There's just the Douane and the 85e, who altogether have maybe 25-30 people, half of which I'd consider active. The Equipage is technically French-allied, but at every larger event they are with the Dutch 1815 forces. Which, let me just state again, is completely retarded (No offence Yoeri, I know you don't really agree with this policy). There were more British France re-enactors than Dutch at Quatre-Bras this year.

[zac]

[joer5835]

It's really weird once you think about it; The state of the French groups in the Netherlands is abysmal. There's just the Douane and the 85e, who altogether have maybe 25-30 people, half of which I'd consider active. The Equipage is technically French-allied, but at every larger event they are with the Dutch 1815 forces. Which, let me just state again, is completely retarded (No offence Yoeri, I know you don't really agree with this policy). There were more British France re-enactors than Dutch at Quatre-Bras this year.

Orangistic bias. The Orange dynasty won, brought the Netherlands into the Coalition and fought Napoleon at Waterloo. SO what you get after that is almost 200 years of us conveniently 'forgetting' everything that was achieved during the 'French' period in our history, which leads to somewhat of a bias towards Orange-aligned troops among Dutch reenactors. And of course the whole issue that most people just want to reenact something closer to home. ie A Dutchman is more inclined to portray a Dutch regiment than a French because the latter often feels foreign to him.

As for the topic of the Equipage, yeah I dislike us being with the Allied army at every major event. And funnily enough, at Quatre Bras the Dutch brigade also told us they rather not have us with them. Which makes perfect sense if you ask me, we aren't an 1815 unit and even then, marines never were in the Bylandt brigade to start with. I understand and completely agree with their reasoning for it. As for what that will mean for the future, I have absolutely no idea and I'd rather not prod anyone. I'll see what happens.

[Duuring]

Re-enact a French equipage? The uniforms were very similair and they even used shakos for a while. And it's actually what happened to Dutch sailors so it's even quite accurate. Just as a suggestion to look into.

[Olafson]

So it might be that we have to change our bonnet yet again, basically back to the old model we thought was inaccurate, but apparently is not.

I hate my life.

[Duuring]

So it might be that we have to change our bonnet yet again, basically back to the old model we thought was inaccurate, but apparently is not.

I hate my life.

Kill meeeeeeeeeee