What is the best Cavalry overall?

[Duuring]

You left out the part where two or three horses were shot from under him.

Once again a good example how leadership and good officers was a deciding factor. Though, I must mention, the whole story is a little bit over-done. I ride myself and I can assure you that it just takes one spooked horse to turn an entire line around - especially horses which were trained so much in keeping line. I'm convinced some of the men did not want to rout but could not control their horses. Though, it can't be denied that, looking at Lasalle's reaction, some of the men really did rout.

[Erik le Rouge]

You left out the part where two or three horses were shot from under him.

His horse died first, then the Brigadier Heisser from the 7e gave him his own, who died a few time later. Two horses died under Lasalle this day

It's all just a matter of where you hit them. Above that, Lasalle was a good horseman and used that to his advantage. He was famous for keeping his men at a trot until the very last yards, maybe 10 to twenty, which meant the horses would be totally fresh and bulk trough the tired horses of the enemy. Murat was the guy that would charge for hundreds of yards in a full galop.

You're right. And that's what General De Brack says in his speech about Cavalry Charges. Did you read it, Duuring ? I don't even know if it was translated in English, I could try it myself, but it's damn long

[Duuring]

Yes, I read it.

The funniest thing is that the worst cavalry was, in fact, British. The lights were decent, the heavies shit. One of the reasons why they were so happy to make the Kings German Legion hussars and Dragoons. The British cavalry had two problems - Bad officers and no discipline. Wellington himself said he considered his cavalry equal with the French, man-to-man, but how larger the formations became, how worse the Brits were. They did have the advantage of better horses, equipment and more training (Just like the infantry), which was usually what saved their asses.

[Jefferson]

I agree with you completely Duuring, altough I would sau that the British heavys in particular could be very good on the initial charge, (see the charge at Salamanca or the initial charge at Waterloo), but after this the men lost all sense of discipline and were next to useless, (see the aftermath of the charge at Waterloo).

[Duuring]

You can't really decide on a regiments quality looking a part of an attack. You can only look at the full extent.

On the 17th the Heavies actually did pretty well in the retreating skirmishes, thanks to their superior horses and better training. Just like Wellington said. Man-to-man or squadron-to-squadron they were a match, just not in bigger situations.

[Jefferson]

Don't worry, I wasn't judging their quality based on part of an attack, it was an observation that the British cavalry appeared to do better when unleashed against a particular target, but lost all discipline afterwards.

If you can take anything from that observation, it's probably that the British cavalry were incredibly unpredictable, and therefore unreliable.

[Wismar]

1. Do you mean best faction in-game or IRL? If it's ing-game then it's probably Austria or France since they have all of the possible classes. IRL, France or Prussia in my opinion.

2. Dragoons are probably the best cavalry overall, realistically. There is a reason pretty much all of the cavalry evolved into some kind of dragoon.

3. What's the difference between Cuirassiers and Carabiniers? I can't tell.

[Duuring]

Uniformal, mostly. Basicly, a carabinier is either a prettier version of a cuirassier, or (so to speak) cuirassiers without armour. Their role is the same.

In the Netherlands, the three Carabinier regiments were raised as Dragoons, retitled 'Zware Dragonders' (Heavy Dragoons) in 1814 and then 'Karabiniers' in early 1815. They were then renamed 'Kuirassiers' after the 1815 campaign and given armour.

Ironicly, in the Kingdom of Holland, the 2nd Cuirassiers did not have armour. The 1st, or Guard Cuirassiers, did.

[Wismar]

I never understood why the whole of Europe change all of their cavalry to dragoons.
Did the other types become ineffective? Or just expensive?

[Archduke Sven]

I never understood why the whole of Europe change all of their cavalry to dragoons.
Did the other types become ineffective? Or just expensive?

Dragoons were simply much cheaper historically, just look at how the British army changed all of it's Regiments of Horse to dragoons in the mid 1700's.

Dragoons were more versatile, as they were mounted infantry and most armies realised cavalry charges were going to become much less common, and mounted infantry would be more useful. However dragoons and other medium cavalry had always been the most numerous in armies. Hussars and heavy cavalry were specialist units, basically the skirmishers and grenadiers of the cavalry, whereas the dragoons were essentially the line infantry.

So although some units of various armies were converted their light and heavies to dragoons (ex. Russia converting all of it's 14 lancer regiments to dragoons). The cavalry always had a majority of dragoons, since they were the cheapest and most versatile.

[Duuring]

One must realize that there were only two types of cavalry in Europa at the end of the Renaissance. The heavy cavalry, the descendent of the knights, were the main arm, with any type of lighter cavalry simply being cheaper and less elite cavalry, besides irregular cavalry like cossacks. It was not until the seven Years war that hussars came to be in Western Europa (Before that only existing in the Austrian army), and the first 'Chasseurs au cheval' or 'light dragoons' do not show up before the 1700s. Only after that, light cavalry can be considered a wholly independent arm of mounted forces, with their own role and tactics.

Dragoons are creating around the same period that the light cavalry becomes independent, as a mobile infantry force that did not require a lot of training on mounted combat. In the years, their focus lays more and more on being the link between the light and the heavily armored cavarly. Some sources, even in the Napoleonics, consider Dragoons to be medium or even light cavalry.

Anyhow, "the whole of Europa" did not change all of their cavalry to Dragoons. It's true that they often had the most regiments, like Sven said, being the sort of 'line cavarly', but hussars, chasseurs, light dragoons, lancers, cuirassiers and carabiniers were in abundance.

By the way, I do not agree with the statement 'most armies realised cavalry charges were going to become much less common'. That idea did not arise until the invention of Percussion Rifles.

[Archduke Sven]

By the way, I do not agree with the statement 'most armies realised cavalry charges were going to become much less common'. That idea did not arise until the invention of Percussion Rifles.

Wasn't sure what era we were talking about, i assumed it was post Napoleonic wars, towards mid 1800's when the second big change to dragoons came around in certain armies.

[Blitz_craig]

Saxony had the best cavalry in the Napoleonic Wars. Napoleon said that having Saxony as an ally was worth it just for their cavalry alone. The Saxon Guard du Corps were the only cavalry regiment in history to successfully attack field fortifications, the Great Redoubt at the Battle of Borodino. The other Saxon heavy regiments, the Von Zastrows and the Cuirassiers of the Guard, also had excellent combat records as did their light cavalry (Chevaulegers, Uhlans, and Hussars).

[Archduke Sven]

Saxony had the best cavalry in the Napoleonic Wars. Napoleon said that having Saxony as an ally was worth it just for their cavalry alone. The Saxon Guard du Corps were the only cavalry regiment in history to successfully attack field fortifications, the Great Redoubt at the Battle of Borodino. The other Saxon heavy regiments, the Von Zastrows and the Cuirassiers of the Guard, also had excellent combat records as did their light cavalry (Chevaulegers, Uhlans, and Hussars).

There was also French cavalry in there during the attack of Raievski redoubt.

[Duuring]

And I'm pretty sure another German regiment too.