Author Topic: [NA] Battle of Bastards Groupfighting [https://bob.caesim.id.lv/table/weekly]  (Read 157414 times)

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Offline Superb_Pedro

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #420 on: June 01, 2018, 08:35:06 am »
Killershark add me on steam so that we discuss your role in admining also Nick too.
I thought the point of us giving you our steam is so you could add us?  :-X. But I added you bb
srry im lazy ......................................................................................

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Offline Moraine

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #421 on: June 01, 2018, 12:38:03 pm »
reading pedros disband list is like annoying



Offline Unitater

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #422 on: June 01, 2018, 07:31:40 pm »
reading pedros disband list is like annoying

Nou
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Offline Superb_Pedro

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #423 on: June 01, 2018, 11:22:19 pm »
All are welcome to come to ts nagf.ts.nfoservers.com to ask questions concerning about the server on fridays 6 pm est!

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Offline Maple™

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #424 on: June 02, 2018, 12:41:43 am »
Postscript: The Problem with Lists
Spoiler
Why lists are always going to be flawed: a breakdown
   
Another day, another list that people find flaws in. Perhaps the most consistent aspect of melee lists is the varied nature of rankings - and the disagreement that will always come with it. The most likely scenario, then is not that we merely need to find the right rankings, or assuming that there is a “right” rankings. Instead, it’s that melee lists will always be controversial and flawed for at least 5 reasons:

1. The impact of a frag
2. The intangibles - IQ, teamplay, communication
3. External stressors
4. Technical limitations
5. Lack of statistics beyond KD’s


   Frag impact: It is often, but not always the case, that first picks in groupfights are important and impactful frags. It is often the case, too, that getting two kills in a 1v5 but losing the clutch is not an example of useful or impactful frags. As well, fragging fluctuates based upon where you are in the groupfight, who you’re with, and the quality of the opposite team. Importantly, none of these are factored into groupfighting rankings! How much of anyone’s kills are impactful? If that question can’t be answered, then the only quantifiable variable that can be taken into account is itself not even as solid of a measure of rating as it often is taken as.

   How do you measure someone’s groupfighting IQ against another person? How do you rank teamplay between players? How important is the quality of communication impactful or measureable? None of these factors are (yet!) measurable, and yet supposedly are taken into account when discussing rating. One of groupfighting’s most important tenants, awareness, is not something that you can measure or statistically analyze in any meaningful way, so to assign a number to someone’s groupfighting skill without being able to assign a number to someone's groupfighting awareness is deeply problematic.

   Ever had cold fingers or stress affect gameplay? How about being yelled at by a family member? If the effect on performance in more commonplace activities can’t be accurately measured by scientists, how is it even remotely possible to have any sense on how external stressors affect NW gameplay? It seems like a significant variable to control for, but since it can’t even be calculated, it certainly can’t be controlled for.

   There has been many documented cases of increased fps or a better computer having a positive on gameplay, but there has also been cases of players overcoming technical limitation. So, how much does this variable factor into melee rankings? I certainly can’t tell you.

   Often people gripe about the possibility of assists being calculated in NW. That highlights an important problem - only two statistics are measured by the game: kills and deaths. Somehow list makers extrapolate many different statistics (usefulness, tactics, etc) from a game that only calculates kills and deaths. Perhaps a reason why lists vary between people is that they all use different criteria, and none of them have an agreed upon statistical footing. Until stats like KAST, RWS or something to that affect are able to calculated in NW, getting a picture of a players impact is going to be purely a personal opinion.

   In conclusion, lists are bunk, and we really should stop this charade that lists are realistic in any way.
[close]

https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=34981.new#new

Offline Kovyjack

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #425 on: June 02, 2018, 02:38:27 am »
Postscript: The Problem with Lists
Spoiler
Why lists are always going to be flawed: a breakdown
   
Another day, another list that people find flaws in. Perhaps the most consistent aspect of melee lists is the varied nature of rankings - and the disagreement that will always come with it. The most likely scenario, then is not that we merely need to find the right rankings, or assuming that there is a “right” rankings. Instead, it’s that melee lists will always be controversial and flawed for at least 5 reasons:

1. The impact of a frag
2. The intangibles - IQ, teamplay, communication
3. External stressors
4. Technical limitations
5. Lack of statistics beyond KD’s


   Frag impact: It is often, but not always the case, that first picks in groupfights are important and impactful frags. It is often the case, too, that getting two kills in a 1v5 but losing the clutch is not an example of useful or impactful frags. As well, fragging fluctuates based upon where you are in the groupfight, who you’re with, and the quality of the opposite team. Importantly, none of these are factored into groupfighting rankings! How much of anyone’s kills are impactful? If that question can’t be answered, then the only quantifiable variable that can be taken into account is itself not even as solid of a measure of rating as it often is taken as.

   How do you measure someone’s groupfighting IQ against another person? How do you rank teamplay between players? How important is the quality of communication impactful or measureable? None of these factors are (yet!) measurable, and yet supposedly are taken into account when discussing rating. One of groupfighting’s most important tenants, awareness, is not something that you can measure or statistically analyze in any meaningful way, so to assign a number to someone’s groupfighting skill without being able to assign a number to someone's groupfighting awareness is deeply problematic.

   Ever had cold fingers or stress affect gameplay? How about being yelled at by a family member? If the effect on performance in more commonplace activities can’t be accurately measured by scientists, how is it even remotely possible to have any sense on how external stressors affect NW gameplay? It seems like a significant variable to control for, but since it can’t even be calculated, it certainly can’t be controlled for.

   There has been many documented cases of increased fps or a better computer having a positive on gameplay, but there has also been cases of players overcoming technical limitation. So, how much does this variable factor into melee rankings? I certainly can’t tell you.

   Often people gripe about the possibility of assists being calculated in NW. That highlights an important problem - only two statistics are measured by the game: kills and deaths. Somehow list makers extrapolate many different statistics (usefulness, tactics, etc) from a game that only calculates kills and deaths. Perhaps a reason why lists vary between people is that they all use different criteria, and none of them have an agreed upon statistical footing. Until stats like KAST, RWS or something to that affect are able to calculated in NW, getting a picture of a players impact is going to be purely a personal opinion.

   In conclusion, lists are bunk, and we really should stop this charade that lists are realistic in any way.
[close]

https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=34981.new#new

Answer to the entire essay:

FT7

Offline Samurai™

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #426 on: June 02, 2018, 02:53:15 am »
.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 03:01:24 am by Samurai™ »

Offline Theodin

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #427 on: June 02, 2018, 04:04:45 am »
Postscript: The Problem with Lists
Spoiler
Why lists are always going to be flawed: a breakdown
   
Another day, another list that people find flaws in. Perhaps the most consistent aspect of melee lists is the varied nature of rankings - and the disagreement that will always come with it. The most likely scenario, then is not that we merely need to find the right rankings, or assuming that there is a “right” rankings. Instead, it’s that melee lists will always be controversial and flawed for at least 5 reasons:

1. The impact of a frag
2. The intangibles - IQ, teamplay, communication
3. External stressors
4. Technical limitations
5. Lack of statistics beyond KD’s


   Frag impact: It is often, but not always the case, that first picks in groupfights are important and impactful frags. It is often the case, too, that getting two kills in a 1v5 but losing the clutch is not an example of useful or impactful frags. As well, fragging fluctuates based upon where you are in the groupfight, who you’re with, and the quality of the opposite team. Importantly, none of these are factored into groupfighting rankings! How much of anyone’s kills are impactful? If that question can’t be answered, then the only quantifiable variable that can be taken into account is itself not even as solid of a measure of rating as it often is taken as.

   How do you measure someone’s groupfighting IQ against another person? How do you rank teamplay between players? How important is the quality of communication impactful or measureable? None of these factors are (yet!) measurable, and yet supposedly are taken into account when discussing rating. One of groupfighting’s most important tenants, awareness, is not something that you can measure or statistically analyze in any meaningful way, so to assign a number to someone’s groupfighting skill without being able to assign a number to someone's groupfighting awareness is deeply problematic.

   Ever had cold fingers or stress affect gameplay? How about being yelled at by a family member? If the effect on performance in more commonplace activities can’t be accurately measured by scientists, how is it even remotely possible to have any sense on how external stressors affect NW gameplay? It seems like a significant variable to control for, but since it can’t even be calculated, it certainly can’t be controlled for.

   There has been many documented cases of increased fps or a better computer having a positive on gameplay, but there has also been cases of players overcoming technical limitation. So, how much does this variable factor into melee rankings? I certainly can’t tell you.

   Often people gripe about the possibility of assists being calculated in NW. That highlights an important problem - only two statistics are measured by the game: kills and deaths. Somehow list makers extrapolate many different statistics (usefulness, tactics, etc) from a game that only calculates kills and deaths. Perhaps a reason why lists vary between people is that they all use different criteria, and none of them have an agreed upon statistical footing. Until stats like KAST, RWS or something to that affect are able to calculated in NW, getting a picture of a players impact is going to be purely a personal opinion.

   In conclusion, lists are bunk, and we really should stop this charade that lists are realistic in any way.
[close]

https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=34981.new#new

Answer to the entire essay:

FT7
what happens if you tie exactly in ft7's? Obviously one of you is more skilled than the other
FT7s are never consistent enough to show skill difference

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Offline Stroke0fd34th

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #428 on: June 02, 2018, 04:12:41 am »
Postscript: The Problem with Lists
Spoiler
Why lists are always going to be flawed: a breakdown
   
Another day, another list that people find flaws in. Perhaps the most consistent aspect of melee lists is the varied nature of rankings - and the disagreement that will always come with it. The most likely scenario, then is not that we merely need to find the right rankings, or assuming that there is a “right” rankings. Instead, it’s that melee lists will always be controversial and flawed for at least 5 reasons:

1. The impact of a frag
2. The intangibles - IQ, teamplay, communication
3. External stressors
4. Technical limitations
5. Lack of statistics beyond KD’s


   Frag impact: It is often, but not always the case, that first picks in groupfights are important and impactful frags. It is often the case, too, that getting two kills in a 1v5 but losing the clutch is not an example of useful or impactful frags. As well, fragging fluctuates based upon where you are in the groupfight, who you’re with, and the quality of the opposite team. Importantly, none of these are factored into groupfighting rankings! How much of anyone’s kills are impactful? If that question can’t be answered, then the only quantifiable variable that can be taken into account is itself not even as solid of a measure of rating as it often is taken as.

   How do you measure someone’s groupfighting IQ against another person? How do you rank teamplay between players? How important is the quality of communication impactful or measureable? None of these factors are (yet!) measurable, and yet supposedly are taken into account when discussing rating. One of groupfighting’s most important tenants, awareness, is not something that you can measure or statistically analyze in any meaningful way, so to assign a number to someone’s groupfighting skill without being able to assign a number to someone's groupfighting awareness is deeply problematic.

   Ever had cold fingers or stress affect gameplay? How about being yelled at by a family member? If the effect on performance in more commonplace activities can’t be accurately measured by scientists, how is it even remotely possible to have any sense on how external stressors affect NW gameplay? It seems like a significant variable to control for, but since it can’t even be calculated, it certainly can’t be controlled for.

   There has been many documented cases of increased fps or a better computer having a positive on gameplay, but there has also been cases of players overcoming technical limitation. So, how much does this variable factor into melee rankings? I certainly can’t tell you.

   Often people gripe about the possibility of assists being calculated in NW. That highlights an important problem - only two statistics are measured by the game: kills and deaths. Somehow list makers extrapolate many different statistics (usefulness, tactics, etc) from a game that only calculates kills and deaths. Perhaps a reason why lists vary between people is that they all use different criteria, and none of them have an agreed upon statistical footing. Until stats like KAST, RWS or something to that affect are able to calculated in NW, getting a picture of a players impact is going to be purely a personal opinion.

   In conclusion, lists are bunk, and we really should stop this charade that lists are realistic in any way.
[close]

https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=34981.new#new

Answer to the entire essay:

FT7
what happens if you tie exactly in ft7's? Obviously one of you is more skilled than the other
FT7s are never consistent enough to show skill difference

That rarely happens

if it does, you just judge it by rounds won and lost vs eachother.

If it's like 7-5, 5-7, 7-5, 5-7, 7-5, 5-7

then they're evenly matched, simple as that.

Offline Superb_Pedro

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MATT123456789

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #430 on: June 05, 2018, 03:09:17 am »
Name: MATT
Date of the ban: i think a week ago
Why you were banned: just abusing my hacks too much, became too blatant, everyone was calling out my obvious hacks in the server
guid:  1515998

Offline Superb_Pedro

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #431 on: June 06, 2018, 07:12:47 pm »
Name: MATT
Date of the ban: i think a week ago
Why you were banned: just abusing my hacks too much, became too blatant, everyone was calling out my obvious hacks in the server
guid:  1515998
Unban date June 10. If you get caught hacking again, I will ban you for 2 months and the third time will be perma.

01stdisband 84edisband USMCdisband 45edisband 45ereformdisband 45e2ndtimereformdisband 45ebrigade disband 45e3rdtimereform 57threform 13thFLdisband 13thFLreform 13thFLdisband 15edisband AEF disband 1stvistule disband 1eKM disband 32edisband 3evolt disband 41stdisband nr8LGdisband 71stdisband 6tedisband 6tebrigadedisband 3teSLRdisband 1stIBdisband 1stRMdisband 4thrvbdisband HREdisband KHdisband 2handisband 54threformdisband 61edisband 1erPLGdisband 1stLCdisband 1stVIistuledisband AGBdisband 63Edisband 63ebrigadedisband nr4disband REglatinodisband 87thdisband 58e disband 42disband nagfidsband 1stRMmergedisband    the list keeps disbanding

MATT123456789

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #432 on: June 06, 2018, 08:51:55 pm »
Damn RIP my k/d then

Offline LiquidSkorpion

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #433 on: June 07, 2018, 04:08:20 am »
Name: MATT
Date of the ban: i think a week ago
Why you were banned: just abusing my hacks too much, became too blatant, everyone was calling out my obvious hacks in the server
guid:  1515998
Unban date June 10. If you get caught hacking again, I will ban you for 2 months and the third time will be perma.
I love it when pedro takes control

MATT123456789

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Re: Battle of Bastards Groupfighting / www.bobgroupfightleaderboards.tk
« Reply #434 on: June 10, 2018, 06:23:03 am »
Name: MATT
Date of the ban: i think a week ago
Why you were banned: just abusing my hacks too much, became too blatant, everyone was calling out my obvious hacks in the server
guid:  1515998
Unban date June 10. If you get caught hacking again, I will ban you for 2 months and the third time will be perma.