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Do you prefer fire on the charge?

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Author Topic: A word on fire on the charge  (Read 4635 times)

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Offline Audiate

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A word on fire on the charge
« on: July 03, 2014, 06:47:48 am »
It's come to my attention over the past few months that "Fire on Charge" has become a serious taboo just about everywhere in the North American community. In Europe, FoC would almost never be an issue due to generally larger numbers being that there are simply more people in Europe than there are in North America, and there are more Europeans playing NW than there are North Americans. When European lines would charge and shoot as they charged, defending lines (lines being charged) would often lose a considerable amount of players immediately before melee, but there would still be a considerable number of men left alive to continue the battle in melee. I'll reference an old video from the summer of 2012 of a linebattle between the 91st and 33rd as an example of this:

Spoiler
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However, when it comes to North America, it seems that being shot right before melee is considerably less tolerated. North Americans do not like being killed without the opportunity to melee. I guess we might as well not shoot at all, right? That said, there will always be times where people will get shot before melee and they'll just have to live with it. They already do. So why is being shot a little bit prior to melee such a problem?

My personal stance on this issue is this: firing on the charge should be allowed simply because I don't see reasons why it shouldn't, and that said, it also adds some additional spice in engagements. I can understand if the number of rankers per line would influence whether or not two regiments would want to allow fire on the charge during 1v1s, and I can also understand why reloading on a charge is undesirable. However, I don't see why that means it should be taken out of gameplay entirely.

On an added note, I also think that disallowing firing on charges backs up the North American tendency of having smaller regiments--everyone wants a piece at the big-seat and it leads to splits, disbands, failed merges, and so on. It's an indirectly related issue, but the lack of firing in charge on melee makes smaller regiments more "considerable" on the battlefield, when really, it means a lot less average stability in the North American regiments and thus, eventually, a lack of interested and dedicated players in regiments due to a lot of them leaving the game after their previous regiment disbands. However, that is a discussion for another day.

Feel free to discuss either side of this, it's clearly only going to reach philosophical debate level, and not community reform level.

Offline Butts

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2014, 06:50:46 am »
I like FoC but I feel like regiments are too small for it, as in, when you have a giant regiment like the 29th, doing a massive FoC against a small regiment, it just seems unfair. It really depends on the size in my opinon.

Offline Grimsight

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2014, 06:56:21 am »
In general I feel like FoC is just an easy way out when a leader gets their line in a bad spot. You still get to use your shots so it doesn't matter what ditch you've led you and your men into, you still get to shoot the enemy to shit. Its just annoying

Offline Newkirk

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2014, 07:00:48 am »
In general I feel like FoC is just an easy way out when a leader gets their line in a bad spot. You still get to use your shots so it doesn't matter what ditch you've led you and your men into, you still get to shoot the enemy to shit. Its just annoying
+1

The only time I see it as acceptable is when I was in the 77y a couple of years ago, we would charge and fire a volley on the charge. Without lining up, everyone just fires at the same time before we hit the enemy with bayonets. I can deal with that as it is organized and much less random, other than that, no. It's not a tactic I support.

Offline Malakith

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2014, 12:58:18 pm »
Interesting you reference us there Newkirk as all events we have ever hosted refuse to allow Fire in the charge.

If done "properly" it wouldn't be an issue, but half the time it isn't. You have regiments "Charging" from half the map away and it just turns the fight into basically a bunch of skirmishers, especially if some go into melee and some stand to reload.
For large events it just ends up with needing a permanent admin sat in spectator to monitor the thing and sort out arguments which lets face it isn't something people want to do, they came to play a game not watch it.

For 1v1's I can see why it might be favored but for large multi-class events it is just a way to make line infantry more "flexible" to placate the grumbling melee players who don't feel so special with a cannonball in their face, cavalry taunting them with hit and run or a skirmisher taking pot shots at them.

Offline Newkirk

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2014, 05:31:09 pm »
It was right at two years ago back in MM Malakith, I don't remember who hosted the event or anything, just remember that being a thing.

Offline Rutger Müller

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2014, 05:38:17 pm »
I think that it is a bit dumb running around in circles for 5 minutes

Offline FrithBiscuit

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2014, 05:39:31 pm »
It's FiC, not FoC.

Fire out of Charge would imply that you're firing when in a line.  :-*

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Offline Audiate

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2014, 05:44:06 pm »
Fair point given, Malakith. We can't upset those special snowflakes that get intimidated by a gaming simulation of a series of terrible wars. The 71st's event, which the 91st attends and is familiar with, allows fire in charge in a way that heavy administration isn't necessary, but it being a line-only event does help. I have, several times in the past, administrated or co-administrated events by staying in spectator and carefully watching things from above. The 8pp Official Linebattle was a success, I'd say, with firing on the charge allowed through volleys and with reloading in charge not allowed, and the only issue with the whole event was server lag.

I think that it is a bit dumb running around in circles for 5 minutes

Quite true, and I think with the ability to successfully fire on the charge would motivate some regiments to engage quicker given the circumstances that they would also have to deal with enemy cavalry, skirmishers, and/or artillery.

It's FiC, not FoC.

Fire out of Charge would imply that you're firing when in a line.  :-*

Fire on charge*

Offline Becker-

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2014, 05:51:08 pm »
Spotters are quitters is how I look at it.


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Offline Saga

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2014, 06:20:33 pm »
I consider firing in a charge another factor to consider when facing a line. If anything it makes the leader think more thus resulting in a much more stressed match but more fun in general.

It also allows us to live through this moment. Especially when you kill a well known melee player
Spoiler
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DzcOCyHDqc[/youtube]
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Offline lindblom

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2014, 10:18:27 pm »
Well, I guess it's always been a question of personal skill and what you prefer. I do not want to take everyone over the same edge so to speak, but an majority of those who would pointblank you in an lb does it because their melee are their weaker side. It's ofc understandable from their perspective but I sadly think it really destroys the melee part of a charge. Let's face it, without melee, this game would not be very fun ^^

Offline FrithBiscuit

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2014, 02:32:52 pm »
It's FiC, not FoC.

Fire out of Charge would imply that you're firing when in a line.  :-*

Fire on charge*

How would fire on charge make sense? Fire in charge is betterm09
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Offline Saga

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2014, 06:32:06 pm »
#FireInCharge

Offline Walko

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Re: A word on fire on the charge
« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2014, 07:50:23 pm »
Fire in charge is shit.
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