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The Lounge => Historical Discussion => Topic started by: Black Watch 1745 on July 17, 2016, 03:42:02 pm

Title: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 17, 2016, 03:42:02 pm
(note: I was half debating whether or not to start this in the historical section but decided to put it here since the historical section is more military based)
  One of my main historical interests outside of the Napoleonic Wars, the World Wars, the English Civil War etc. are the great liners at the turn of the last century, mainly the Titanic and the Lusitania but others are quite interesting as well.
   I wish to concentrate the discussion on the three great Olympic Class Liners (Olympic, Titanic and Britannic) and the two great Cunarders (Mauritania and Lusitania) but if people wish to expand this and talk about the other great liners of this era (the German liners for example) then that is fine.
  I will start with the Titanic. The survivors are long gone now but this interview was done back in 1957. Sadly some of it has been lost (the BBC had a deplorable policy of taping over or even destroying film once it had been broadcast) but a good portion is still there. The most interesting part in my opinion is with Harold Cottam who was the wireless operator on the Carpathia:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVLiZo6Pkak
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Duuring on July 18, 2016, 05:45:44 pm
There might be more focus on militairy subjects, but this still belongs in the Historical Section.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 18, 2016, 06:17:05 pm
^^ only likes Brit boats.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_K-19#Nuclear_accident
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typhoon-class_submarine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seawise_Giant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batillus-class_supertankers


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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsafeshippingbc.ca%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F04%2Flng-carrier-main.jpg&hash=94039bb2b3426ba1dc90162f8c8d4bddfbeaa13c)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1f/LNGtanker.jpg)
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Also the major ships that are used in the great lakes are kinda astonishing, those are huge ships that are dedicated to a life lake where the only countries ports they will ever dock at are either Canadian or U.S.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 18, 2016, 06:45:03 pm
Erm, those aren't passenger liners. They are marvels of engineering though I will give you that.
(And thanks for moving it, it probably makes more sense for the thread to be here).
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 18, 2016, 07:21:33 pm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_America_(1939)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Waratah
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 18, 2016, 07:28:29 pm
I have never heard of the SS Waratah till now. Amazing how it disappeared without trace and of course we will never know what happened to it unless they find the wreck.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 18, 2016, 07:35:56 pm
I wouldn't be surprised if we never found out what happened, especially if its wrecked in antartica.

The ocean is a scary place and it's scary to think how we send some rust buckets out there that have inexperienced crews with expired licenses.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 18, 2016, 07:45:50 pm
One of the things with the Titanic was that it's crew was not experienced enough with launching lifeboats. Whilst most had served on other vessels, the Titanic was using newer Welin davits for the lifeboats (they differed from earlier designs still in use on other vessels). Even if she had had enough lifeboats it is doubtful whether the crew could have launched all the boats in time (they were still trying to launch the last two boats, Collapsible's A and B, when she started to make the final plunge). More would have been saved if there were more boats no doubt but even so, you need time and a crew that has clear instructions on what it is doing.
  The Lusitania is a prime example of what happens when there is little time to evacuate a ship. She sank in roughly eighteen minutes and got only a handful of her boats away successfully, not least because the ones on the starboard side swung away from the ship whilst the ones on the port side smashed into her hull.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 18, 2016, 08:03:57 pm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jian_Seng

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ourang_Medan
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 19, 2016, 03:24:29 am
Wasn't there something fairly recently with an abandoned ship full of rats coming close to the UK?

With the Titanic it is amazing how beautiful her interiors were (note some of these are from the Olympic which differ slightly):
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic1.squarespace.com%2Fstatic%2F5006453fe4b09ef2252ba068%2Ft%2F508cebe8e4b09d6a62974af7%2F1351412717909%2FFirst%2BClass%2BSmoking%2BRoom%2BTitanic.jpg&hash=d3c068426a85e7384010525eed99c885ad8a64a6)
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(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ab/9c/7c/ab9c7cd350c527ffa1835273741114c3.jpg)
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(https://forsythkid.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/1st-class-lounge.jpg?w=640)
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fresources1.news.com.au%2Fimages%2F2012%2F03%2F30%2F1226314%2F609185-titanics-turkish-bath.jpg&hash=6ac17733d620575d5f158b1500d7cc2d111c2330)
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That last one is of the Turkish Bath's. That part of the wreck is actually quite well preserved (compared to the rest of the wreck):
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fngm.nationalgeographic.com%2F2012%2F04%2Ftitanic%2Fimg%2Fturkish-bath-tiles-650.jpg&hash=4eddabb1d82b740c8263ad746eb0c9c3c67bf570)
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Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 19, 2016, 05:21:29 am
The cannibal rat ship was debunked I believe.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 20, 2016, 01:56:00 pm
Here is an interesting one. The RMS Empress of Ireland:
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/15/Empress_of_Ireland.jpg)
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She was on the north Atlantic run (Quebec to Liverpool) in 1914 when a Norwegian vessel, the SS Storstad, collided with her at about 2:00 in the morning along the St Lawrence River. The Empress of Ireland sank in about 14 minutes killing 1000 people out of the 1400 on board, most of the people on the lower decks drowning almost immediately.
WW1 broke out a few months later and thus the disaster went out of the news and, whilst I believe it is well known in Canada, it has become largely forgotten compared to other disasters such as the Titanic and the Lusitania.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 20, 2016, 03:44:35 pm
Quote from: Black Watch 1745 on July 20, 2016, 01:56:00 pm
Here is an interesting one. The RMS Empress of Ireland:
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/15/Empress_of_Ireland.jpg)
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She was on the north Atlantic run (Quebec to Liverpool) in 1914 when a Norwegian vessel, the SS Storstad, collided with her at about 2:00 in the morning along the St Lawrence River. The Empress of Ireland sank in about 14 minutes killing 1000 people out of the 1400 on board, most of the people on the lower decks drowning almost immediately.
WW1 broke out a few months later and thus the disaster went out of the news and, whilst I believe it is well known in Canada, it has become largely forgotten compared to other disasters such as the Titanic and the Lusitania.

The Saint Lawrence river is a 20min walk from my place lol. I can see the bridge across it if I get on my roof and i've never heard of this.



https://youtu.be/dHOMRsHS6no
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 21, 2016, 01:24:32 am
Yeah, as I said it is largely unknown now, overshadowed by the war which broke out later. Amazing how it sank so fast although I beleive they did not have time to close the watertight doors and some passengers had left their portholes open meaning water rushed in.
Here is the SS Storstad (the ship that hit it) just after the accident.
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rimouskiweb.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2FStorstad%2520%281917%29.jpg%3Fslideshow%3Dtrue%26amp%3BslideshowAuto%3Dtrue%26amp%3BslideshowSpeed%3D4000%26amp%3Bspeed%3D350%26amp%3Btransition%3Delastic&hash=730b0204a457093c3aa8905d23534bf1ad85d184)
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And an artists intepretation of the RMS Empress of Ireland's wreck today:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.darpanmagazine.com%2Fnews%2Fcontent%2Fcanada-titanic3.jpg&hash=f35a60f141f4f5647f257b467dedd46f8c160876)
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One interesting story I came across was of the Olympic, sister to the Titanic, ramming and sinking a German U-Boat in 1918, the only civilian ship to sink an enemy submarine:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg15.deviantart.net%2F84e5%2Fi%2F2015%2F222%2Fb%2F0%2Fdoomsday_for_u_103_by_121199-d956dlw.jpg&hash=f6b7555a784b7037f365f3763d81f5b4e474487e)
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Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 21, 2016, 03:37:22 am
Quote from: Black Watch 1745 on July 21, 2016, 01:24:32 am
One interesting story I came across was of the Olympic, sister to the Titanic, ramming and sinking a German U-Boat in 1918, the only civilian ship to sink an enemy submarine:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg15.deviantart.net%2F84e5%2Fi%2F2015%2F222%2Fb%2F0%2Fdoomsday_for_u_103_by_121199-d956dlw.jpg&hash=f6b7555a784b7037f365f3763d81f5b4e474487e)
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That's hilarious.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Riddlez on July 21, 2016, 03:01:19 pm
U-boat alledgedly thought it was an iceberg
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 21, 2016, 03:02:42 pm
Oceanic alledgedly thought it was an iceberg
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Ted on July 23, 2016, 11:11:14 am
http://www.titanichg.com/
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 23, 2016, 12:38:26 pm
Quote from: Ted on July 23, 2016, 11:11:14 am
http://www.titanichg.com/
It does look like it will be quite an interesting game. That video they did of the sinking in real time was good although there were some inaccuracies (most minor quibbles but a few big ones like the bridge ordering hard a starboard before the lookouts have even reported in).

  Another interesting incident with the Olympic happened in 1911 when the British cruiser HMS Hawke rammed into her.
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssmaritime.com%2FOlympic-damage-HMS-Hawke-painting.jpg&hash=b2db42523c3f00036d01e8efb0f78d7f19134d8f)
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/eb/Hawke_-_Olympic_collision.JPG)
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  It was believed that the cruiser was sucked into the Olympic by the Olympic's propellers. Incidentally Captain Smith who would later command the Titanic was in charge of the Olympic at the time.
The Titanic herself had a mishap within minutes of leaving port. Again, her propellers displaced quite a lot of water and sucked a moored liner, the SS New York, away from the docks, only narrowly avoiding a collision.
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F65.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lo73waL5x91qzxifn.png&hash=5ed67bef9953d0211c9d52eaf09fa8f9c8f69ab2)
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcruiselinehistory.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F04%2Ftitanic0014.13.01-PM.png&hash=b37f966a809f8184644c8e6c03e00d3abf96ea3e)
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(https://symonsez.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/titanicoceaonicnewyork.jpg)
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EDIT: Well Olympic was still at it in 1934:
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmWI1RC0yr0
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Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Riddlez on July 23, 2016, 10:02:51 pm
What a perfect name for a Captain.
Still doesn't beat the USS Zumwalt though.

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Kirk. Like, literally
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Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 25, 2016, 12:25:57 pm
More accidents from the Olympic. She threw a propeller blade crossing the Atlantic in early 1912, forcing her to go back to Belfast for repairs:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F41.media.tumblr.com%2F45182e50155b6dc60a1325952132e25c%2Ftumblr_nbteikNX5C1qgen3wo1_500.jpg&hash=34bb9cadcf5913c742bf4d3a71eadde02303e0b6)
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They decided to take one of Titanic's propellers for the Olympic, meaning that the Titanic's maiden voyage had to be pushed back to April 10th (it was meant to be the 20th March). Several weeks after the Titanic sank, Olympic nearly ran aground on some rocks off lands end. The captain at the time was Captain Haddock, who was also the first captain of the Titanic.
This is what he looked like:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthebacknumber.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F06%2FCaptain-Herbert-J-Haddock.jpg&hash=dd9225aad2aef1521f40ab391c2899e50bb7af46)
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Not this:
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(https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg04.deviantart.net%2Feacc%2Fi%2F2013%2F361%2F7%2Fc%2Fcaptain_haddock_in_a_bad_mood_by_ironsid0r-d6zl3om.jpg&hash=67fe01621c5e42679cda0a65af790ee3c48884ac)
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Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 25, 2016, 12:29:43 pm
lol wtf

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violet_Jessop
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on July 25, 2016, 12:40:24 pm
Quote from: MarshalKim on July 25, 2016, 12:29:43 pm
lol wtf

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violet_Jessop
Yeah, after the first time I would not have been too keen to go on another Olympic Class liner again myself but not Violet!
At least they got most of the people off the Britannic in time, apart from thirty people in two boats who got sucked into the propellers.
Another interesting chap is Alfred Vanderbilt.
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Alfred_Vanderbilt..JPG)
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He was meant to be on the Titanic but at the very last minute he cancelled his trip. Initially he was listed as one of the casualties. Three years later though he was on the Lusitania when it sank and he died in the sinking. He could not swim but he still gave his lifejacket to a female passenger and tried to find more lifejackets for others.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 25, 2016, 01:47:22 pm
Freak waves and shit. Ocean is mean place. I'd rather be part of a Soyuz Launch.
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: MarshalKim on July 27, 2016, 02:53:22 pm
http://server2.vidmax.com/video/141761-Launching-of-the-largest-nuclear-powered-icebreaker-in-the-world-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arktika_(1972_icebreaker)
Title: Re: The Great Ocean Liners thread (Titanic, Lusitania etc.)
Post by: Black Watch 1745 on August 02, 2016, 11:53:10 am
Here is another interesting one, a German liner this time. The SS Kaiser Wilhelm Der Grosse:
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/Kaiser_wilhelm_der_grosse_01.jpg/800px-Kaiser_wilhelm_der_grosse_01.jpg)
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She was built about the same time as the Cunarders and had three sister ships (the SS Kronprinz Wilhelm, the SS Kaiser Wilhelm II and the SS Kronprinzessin Cecilie). The ship is quite interesting as, along with her sisters, she was pressed into service during the war and was sunk at the Battle of Río de Oro in August 1914.
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2a/Kaiser_Wilhelm_der_Grosse_fight_painting_1914.jpg)
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There is some dispute over whether the Germans scuttled her or whether British gunfire had doomed the ship anyway:
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Kaiser_Wilhelm_Der_Grosse%27s_Wreck.jpg)
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