Author Topic: 2019 is for me the end of NW  (Read 21253 times)

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Offline Nosswill

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #60 on: February 27, 2019, 03:56:50 pm »
How is a team stacked when it becomes good with the same core of players?
It's hard to admit but you frenchies are right I guess. After all the good players left and the frenchies started to tryhard, they became best without adding some extra super pro player to their lineup.
Darkcore , the coke of noswill and moskito  .. Is their any places remaining in  your mouth ?
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Offline Benallo

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #61 on: February 27, 2019, 04:46:14 pm »
You're going too far guys It's not the main subject of that thread.

Offline Bagins

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #62 on: February 27, 2019, 05:03:46 pm »
The skill level has both increased overall yet decreased at the top recently, not to mention the meta that most of the new gens have employed to compete with the older more experienced players has caused some controversy with whole teams being labeled as cancer to play (not just individual players) and so on.

The reason only 10% of players take duel tourneys seriously is because EU dueling has become a joke and there are only some willing to bear it to get their 5 minutes of fame.
 
Frenchtouch's "era" was around when there was a lul in competition as teams like PowerRangers and TFFO were fazing out, yet I can still agree that it was one of the best teams of all time.
Players like Extazz and Drake have never been in an underdog team that hasn't included the same group of FT lads so Extazz u cant really chat to Golden about that.
Edit: Credit where its Due FT made themselves from nothing but its players haven't been successful anywhere else.

Golden the only time u haven't been in a top team in the recent competitive scene is when you first joined TBE.

Having stacked teams like Poosy and All-stars doesn't make it fun for everyone else which is why it probably made the scene more fun after the teams disbanded and their skilled players dissipated into separate teams.

Yes there are too many tourneys.

No it probably won't change peoples attitudes if they are hosted less as most of the main people left have made up their mind on how they feel about playing.


 
« Last Edit: February 27, 2019, 05:49:18 pm by Bagins »

Offline Eamon

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #63 on: February 27, 2019, 05:11:16 pm »
Fotin once said I'd be unstoppable if I was any good at tryharding

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Looking for a gf team btw
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Offline Matt_

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #64 on: February 27, 2019, 05:17:02 pm »
But yeah im sorry for not joining kamikaze or something and losing like 0-5 every tourny.

seems about right

Offline Eamon

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #65 on: February 27, 2019, 05:18:32 pm »
But yeah im sorry for not joining kamikaze or something and losing like 0-5 every tourny.

seems about right

I'm going to join Kamikaze, adopt a French accent, have no friends, and put timing notes on the side of my monitor, KamiTouch incoming !

Offline Wastee

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #66 on: February 27, 2019, 05:42:18 pm »
Draft leagues can be pretty neat

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Offline Voluble123

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #67 on: February 27, 2019, 06:01:49 pm »
I would say 2 main things:
1) The average age of competitive players has increased overtime as not enough new people getting that interested in the game to take up competitive and therefore meaning when people get to that stage in their life when they dont have as much free time, you want to spend it more wisely and after many years of the same shit, maybe some people have just given up for one reason or another and over the past year or so this has dug away at the core of people in the community that probably kept it running from regimental leaders like Salakien; Pieter and Pride to GF leaders like Drake and other fuck boys who im too new to know. When big characters go gradually over time the size of the community smallens and everyone merges together into teams and longstory short thats how people get stacked and makes tournies not winnable for 80% of the teams and boring for the other 20%.

2) The amount of tournaments hosted, especially in 2018. There was like atleast 2 or 3 a month and that is to me, the sole reason we are in the state of not enjoying the game and and why its on its last legs. A combination of Moskito, Herishey, MarxeiL and MightyPaiN hosted quite a lot of Tournaments and Leagues and when you have them really frequent it takes the rarity feeling of proving u are the best away, how it is now is you win a tourny then two weeks later u need to defend the tourny win etc. That in itself takes away the enjoyment and reward of winning but when u combine that with the fact some people have played for lots of years and not had 1 a month  for several months  then to go to this many, can be draining and ruin the feeling in general. Think what im saying is people have burnt themselves out by participating in all the tournaments in 2018 and mid to late 2017 and just stop playing as the feeling they once thought about a tournament was fading away with the members that was slowly leaving.

Yeah i might have the gramma police, out in full force! on this one. But I said what i thought as this seemed the thread to express opinions :)
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Offline Golden.

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #68 on: February 27, 2019, 06:47:40 pm »
The skill level has both increased overall yet decreased at the top recently, not to mention the meta that most of the new gens have employed to compete with the older more experienced players has caused some controversy with whole teams being labeled as cancer to play (not just individual players) and so on.

The reason only 10% of players take duel tourneys seriously is because EU dueling has become a joke and there are only some willing to bear it to get their 5 minutes of fame.
 
Frenchtouch's "era" was around when there was a lul in competition as teams like PowerRangers and TFFO were fazing out, yet I can still agree that it was one of the best teams of all time.
Players like Extazz and Drake have never been in an underdog team that hasn't included the same group of FT lads so Extazz u cant really chat to Golden about that.
Edit: Credit where its Due FT made themselves from nothing but its players haven't been successful anywhere else.

Golden the only time u haven't been in a top team in the recent competitive scene is when you first joined TBE.

Having stacked teams like Poosy and All-stars doesn't make it fun for everyone else which is why it probably made the scene more fun after the teams disbanded and their skilled players dissipated into separate teams.

Yes there are too many tourneys.

No it probably won't change peoples attitudes if they are hosted less as most of the main people left have made up their mind on how they feel about playing.


 

I agree with you bagins and im not saying I wasn't in top teams but I at least tried to counteract the cancer that was just the same top 3 teams winning over and over again, and the ridiculous stacked teams that begin from late 2016 onwards. And yes Frenchtouch was pretty good. And you have to admit poosy and chimpz were both overly stacked to shit after all-stars and FT left.

Offline Sir Obelix

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #69 on: February 28, 2019, 12:45:48 am »
people are getting bored bcs 98% of players have the same playstyle, we need an update to change this low ping blockchamber meta  8)
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Offline Nero_

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #70 on: February 28, 2019, 07:30:57 am »
ChimpZ Academy was supposed to be the solution, but no one listened to Hokej :-\

Offline sirkaide

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #71 on: March 01, 2019, 02:43:01 pm »
The community cannot be counted on for a few reasons. We have the same old tired dinosaurs that would never leave and controlled the competitive scene for so long.
Secondly, when you try and run a decent event or competition you get alot of shit and alot of people let you down. I ran multiple events a week for 5 years and it was very stressful at times.

My last competition that I hosted was the NWCL - https://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=33837.msg1461209#msg1461209

I believe it was well organised but I really struggled with regiments and people dropping out.



« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 02:46:35 pm by sirkaide »

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #72 on: March 01, 2019, 03:01:27 pm »
On FT
Spoiler
@Golden FT isn't stacked, we started from the bottom, learning A to Z, in a uncompetitive and pretty hostile french community dominated by GB and GER on the eu scene at the time, for most we started in randomish regiments, a community in which dozen regiment would be estimated better, in which dozens of players would be estimated better.


Just don't forget, back then, herishey or lebrave could tell you about, it was all about the anglo-sphere, if you we'rent part of them or friends with them (like : 91st, 92nd, GB, 1st 17e?) you would have to do 2 or 3x more, if you we'rent part of their teams or organizations they run, like FFE for exemple, you probably wouldn't be backed up by them as a good/top groupfighter. They would always say the best frenchie is their frenchie, the best polish is their polish, the one that plays for them.
No lie, they we're winning, but you get what i meant. it's harder.

Being britons or english-speaking in this game (even nowadays for the whole EU experience), joining those pillar organizations, you would easily and steadily improve, meet very good players, learn about the "meta" of then, make them learn about you and back you to get in good teams, and all in all : your get your ticket easier for the eu scene top show. And despite not coming from this environment, hostilities in our own community, we made it from scratch, and our meta is still unmatched, favored, and continue to influence as obelix stated, we get the credits for the meta right (8 EU duel gold, 5/6 silver, bronzes etc...), tryhards they say. FT was the place we offered safety, solidarity, good fun, and constant improving curve, that's why people like fwuffy joined and stayed, not for winning, he stayed even when we faced a few losses.
Our core : LeBrave, Maharbaal, ExtaZz94, Drake would never ever leave, allowing us to continue improving at our path to reach the level we did, not by stack strategies.
 What where the chance from some noobish frenchies to climb like that, and establish new standards : very low. So golden, we had a good team we constructed in the first place from A 1) We heavily formed our players 2) Created our own meta 3) Climb the ladder to the top 4) Successed at top with consistance.
[close]

As for all All-Stars, it ended up a super-team no doubt, but not always we had the rosters people might think of, even at our highest, they were still others very good teams, if you look at native, there's the Frontline Tactics (FT rocks both way :D), they have every fucking best player at every positions taking players from former dominant AE to play cash prized tournament. would you imagine gb + fra for a cash prized nwwc ? that's how crazy a true super-team is.

All-Stars was an answer to larger formats, DF, Herishey, Mightypain enforced to "bring more competitions", didn't really succeed at the end, ironically, it wasn't necessary and produced the inverse effect. After FT disbanded, i saw they started hosting 5v5 back, i'm curious but i won't ask them :D. Morale if you want a great scene, host every kinds of tournaments, polyvalence is the real sign of capabilities, if you are the TBE or TFFO leader and only host tournaments your team can plays in then you're not helping your community, no disrespect mighty and herishey friendo.  Edit : However, i want to point out that we can thank these 3 guys for all the time and work they put on organizing events for others people, and this message isn't intended as a blame on them.

Host tournies for duellist, for duo, for trio, for 5 people team, for 8 people team or if you don't like one of theses, host the one you like when needed, don't spam it, that's what i did when hosting a few 5v5.

I believe herishey has a good idea, but it need to be done carefully, doors should always be open, regulating organization is a good solution but it must be handled in a careful way as to who, how, and why decisions are taken, fairness and diversity without conflict of interest or bias.
You could do something like both Tournaments Agenda + List, a system of both tournament opportunities and public rewards and listing, on the basics of what marxeil already done, and huge emphasis only to respect these, not going to play others ones. You can also do lesser numbered tournament but more quality and dedication demanded as Marxeil did, but you would do it with more dedication by players, it will increase the skill ceiling even.

Yes, i mean csgo tournament are made of few teams finally, with more than average motivated and talented guys.

Solution ? You don't need 120 players per tournament, you need interested and motivated players that will really come and produce quality competition and opposition, whether they are 16, 32, or 64. UFC and Boxing only needs 2 guys to make big money. Ask tardets tips for hype. You can very probably add new features to tournies, like just not, signing-up + come at the server + goodbye. Work on regulation, originality, interest, hype and accessibility for every nw players, not just the same 60 people.
One word on originality, it doesn't need to be necessarily new formats and rules, but how do you hype it and make it living and interesting without making it a fun event that hold no contest to it, self-vanity of own guessed capabilities is the fuel of competition at the end of the day.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 03:20:13 pm by Drake »

Offline Golden.

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #73 on: March 01, 2019, 03:19:51 pm »
On FT
Spoiler
@Golden FT isn't stacked, we started from the bottom, learning A to Z, in a uncompetitive and pretty hostile french community dominated by GB and GER on the eu scene at the time, for most we started in randomish regiments, a community in which dozen regiment would be estimated better, in which dozens of players would be estimated better.


Just don't forget, back then, herishey or lebrave could tell you about, it was all about the anglo-sphere, if you we'rent part of them or friends with them (like : 91st, 92nd, GB, 1st 17e?) you would have to do 2 or 3x more, if you we'rent part of their teams or organizations they run, like FFE for exemple, you probably wouldn't be backed up by them as a good/top groupfighter. They would always say the best frenchie is their frenchie, the best polish is their polish, the one that plays for them.
No lie, they we're winning, but you get what i meant. it's harder.

Being britons or english-speaking in this game (even nowadays for the whole EU experience), joining those pillar organizations, you would easily and steadily improve, meet very good players, learn about the "meta" of then, make them learn about you and back you to get in good teams, and all in all : your get your ticket easier for the eu scene top show. And despite not coming from this environment, hostilities in our own community, we made it from scratch, and our meta is still unmatched, favored, and continue to influence as obelix stated, we get the credits for the meta right (8 EU duel gold, 5/6 silver, bronzes etc...), tryhards they say. FT was the place we offered safety, solidarity, good fun, and constant improving curve, that's why people like fwuffy joined and stayed, not for winning, he stayed even when we faced a few losses.
Our core : LeBrave, Maharbaal, ExtaZz94, Drake would never ever leave, allowing us to continue improving at our path to reach the level we did, not by stack strategies.
 What where the chance from some noobish frenchies to climb like that, and establish new standards : very low. So golden, we had a good team we constructed in the first place from A 1) We heavily formed our players 2) Created our own meta 3) Climb the ladder to the top 4) Successed at top with consistance.
[close]

As for all All-Stars, it ended up a super-team no doubt, but not always we had the rosters people might think of, even at our highest, they we're still other very good teams, if you look at native, there's the Frontline Tactics (FT rocks both way :D), they have every fucking best player at every positions taking players from former dominant AE to play cash prized tournament. would you imagine gb + fra for a cash prized nwwc ? that's how crazy a true super-team is.

All-Stars was an answer to larger format, DF, Herishey, Mightypain enforced to "bring more competitions", didn't really succeed at the end, ironically, it wasn't necessary and produced the inverse effect. After FT disbanded, i saw they started hosting 5v5 back, i'm curious but i won't ask them :D. Morale if you want a great scene, host every kinds of tournaments, polyvalence is the real sign of capabilities, if you are the TBE or TFFO leader and only host tournaments your team can plays in then you're not helping your community, no disrespect mighty and herishey friendo.

Host tournies for duellist, for duo, for trio, for 5 people team, for 8 people team or if you don't like one of theses, host the one you like when needed, don't spam it, that's what i did when hosting a few 5v5.

I believe herishey has a good idea, but it need to be done carefully, doors should always be open, regulating organization is a good solution but it must be handled in a careful way as to who, how, and why decisions are taken, fairness and diversity without conflict of interest or bias.
You could do something like both Tournaments Agenda + List, a system of both tournament opportunities and public rewards and listing, on the basics of what marxeil already done, and huge emphasis only to respect these, not going to play others ones. You can also do lesser numbered tournament but more quality and dedication demanded as Marxeil did, but you would do it with more dedication by players, it will increase the skill ceiling even.

Yes, i mean csgo tournament are made of few teams finally, with more than average motivated and talented guys.

Solution ? You don't need 120 players per tournament, you need interested and motivated players that will really come and produce quality competition and opposition, whether they are 16, 32, or 64. UFC and Boxing only needs 2 guys to make big money. Ask tardets tips for hype. You can very probably add new features to tournies, like just not, signing-up + come at the server + goodbye. Work on regulation, originality, interest, hype and accessibility for every nw players, not just the same 60 people.
One word on originality, it doesn't need to be necessarily new formats and rules, but how do you hype it and make it living and interesting without making it a fun event that hold no contest to it, self-vanity of own guessed capabilities is the fuel of competition at the end of the day.

I agree with the majority of what you have said and in regards to FT you are right, however i'm not going to go and agree with the whole meta change. You stated about a certain sphere of players dominating from 2012-2014 I know exactly what you mean by that and it's true. Yes Native have front line tactics but that team doesn't surprise me when they are playing for so much money. Where as on NW it's hard to forget the idea of creating a super team is stupid, it can't really be defended in any matter and a diversity of competition is crucially important to the game actually being enjoyable. I actually think at the moment there is some nice diversity among teams and a fair amount of competition, especially with jedis recent win. But the tournaments need to be like you said made into a bigger event.

Offline Herishey

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Re: 2019 is for me the end of NW
« Reply #74 on: March 01, 2019, 03:21:51 pm »
At the time near the end of TFFO or when I was in TBE I didn't host tournaments only for my team. I simply hosted tournaments I wanted to play in or I enjoyed. I enjoy the larger formats (7v7, 8v8) a bit more as they are less passive and there are more opportunities. That is also why around these times I hosted a few sword based tournaments as I enjoy them. Also I've still never hosted tournaments more than once every 2-3 months (apart from the odd 'fun' one in between).

When I did host tournaments more actively there weren't as many different hosts as there are today so tournaments were still well spread.
I won lots of things, I came 2nd and 3rd in lots of things, I guess I did some other shit too........ I'm also an FSE legend, probably most commonly described as a cunt. If the shit I do doesn't make sense in your head, well fuck you because it makes sense in mine.

Which i did, against known and reputed player, some of them considered legend, such as, Mandarin, Ledger, Tiberias, Herishey, Hokej, Troister, Axiom, Evanovic, Stark, Eddie, Jammo, Bagins, Freddie, Python. I didn't had a good relationship with most of them, but i congratulate them for what they did, and i had pleasure facing them.