The War of 1812 Historic Discussion [New Poll!]

[Conway]

Holy crap what have I started! Either way I like the historical discussion!

[junedragon]

The myth perpetrated by the Canadians (not the government) was that the US planned to annex Canada and force Canadians to become American citizens.

Yes, the US failed to hold Canada long enough to force any of their terms, I was never denying that. Yes, the US lost the war because they failed in this mission. If you'd read earlier in the thread you'd see I completely agree that the US lost the war, as they failed in their war goals. You basically just restated my original argument before it got lost in wikipedia credibility debates and the like. I don't disagree with anything you're saying, except for the first paragraph which is an understandable misrepresentation of my argument, considering I got considerable off-topic halfway through explaining it.

I'm just stating that I'm not convinced (especially by that article) that the annexation of Canada/British North America was never the US goal, even if not one of the immediate ones/ones suggested by the US surrounding its declaration of war.

That's the only real disagreement from your post.

From that other section in the article I quoted and traced back to original sources, there are quite a few creditable historians that believe that annexation either became the US goal or was among them from start (including some Americans).

And in regards to wikipedia's credibility, I find it is most useful as a place to find some original academic sources (in the notes/references sections) on whatever topic is at hand.

[Devmc99]

Dat....

Spoiler

[close]

[Becker-]

The real question here is when was the war of 1812?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Nipplestockings]

The real question here is when was the war of 1812?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

1965-1975. Involved 1,812 US soldiers and that's why it's called that.

[Colonel Howe]

The nationalism stronk

I'm pretty sure ya'll are retardz. Texas won the war and killed all the Mexicans

#getschooledretards

[Bruin]

The nationalism stronk

I'm pretty sure ya'll are retardz. Texas won the war and killed all the Mexicans

#getschooledretards

Texas called us for help and we sent the Mexican's back to Mexico City.
#noob #merryxmas #happyhalloween

[TheBritishLoyalist]

Considering Britain was technically in the defense here and the Muricans failed to conquer anything as well as losing several battles on their own soil, I definitely would say Britain (and not Canada, which was merely a colony) won the war.

I get why Canadians love to say they (Canada) won the war, but that would be rather silly as all the regulars were British. I don't think Canada would have fared so well without the British army.

I agree that Canada would have been massacred without the noble British crown soldiers and I think the only way you can say Canada won is by saying "The British Colonial Provinces of Upper & Lower Canada"

[Duuring]

They weren't even 'Allies'. That would imply they were sovereign nations. They were a colony.

[TheRedRedcoat]

I have a straightforward view of this. The Americans declared war. They didn't make any gains by the end of the war, so they lost the war. The underlying goal of the Americans was to conquer Canada, and the goal of the British was to keep the status quo. All that "2nd War of Independence" is stupid, since the British didn't attack the Americans. Why would they? They had their hands full in Spain in 1812-14.

[Bruin]

I have a straightforward view of this. The Americans declared war. They didn't make any gains by the end of the war, so they lost the war. The underlying goal of the Americans was to conquer Canada, and the goal of the British was to keep the status quo. All that "2nd War of Independence" is stupid, since the British didn't attack the Americans. Why would they? They had their hands full in Spain in 1812-14.

Excesses.

[Balien]

Here are my reasons as to why we CLEARLY won the war

1. The Americans Invaded our country in an attempt to gain land and failed to do so

2. We burnt all public buildings in their capital

3. We held of three invasion attempts

4. At wars end we were invading the attacking country

So yea..... that is why I think we won the War of 1812!

When you say wars end, are you talking about the humiliating defeat at the Battle of New Orleans? Thats not something to brag about..

[Conway]

Here are my reasons as to why we CLEARLY won the war

1. The Americans Invaded our country in an attempt to gain land and failed to do so

2. We burnt all public buildings in their capital

3. We held of three invasion attempts

4. At wars end we were invading the attacking country

So yea..... that is why I think we won the War of 1812!

When you say wars end, are you talking about the humiliating defeat at the Battle of New Orleans? Thats not something to brag about..

The war was over before the battle of New Orleans and also.....

A MAP OF NORTH AMERICAN WHEN THE BATTLE OF NEW ORLEANS WAS FOUGHT 100% ACCURATE!!!!

Spoiler

[close]

Notice how the defending nation had not only held off American attacks on its own land but was now also attacking the invaders on their own soil and not just their own soil but on the other side of their country on which the fighting had begun.

[joer5835]

You should have put a dead bald eagle picture where Washington *used* to be.

[Allasaphore]

Spoiler

Here are my reasons as to why we CLEARLY won the war

1. The Americans Invaded our country in an attempt to gain land and failed to do so

2. We burnt all public buildings in their capital

3. We held of three invasion attempts

4. At wars end we were invading the attacking country

So yea..... that is why I think we won the War of 1812!

When you say wars end, are you talking about the humiliating defeat at the Battle of New Orleans? Thats not something to brag about..

The war was over before the battle of New Orleans and also.....

A MAP OF NORTH AMERICAN WHEN THE BATTLE OF NEW ORLEANS WAS FOUGHT 100% ACCURATE!!!!

Spoiler

[close]

Notice how the defending nation had not only held off American attacks on its own land but was now also attacking the invaders on their own soil and not just their own soil but on the other side of their country on which the fighting had begun.

[close]

Ack, your map doesn't account for the Spanish and Russian possessions. This burns away at my soul.