Author Topic: Let's discuss: Reenacting!  (Read 233463 times)

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Offline Duke Of LongTree

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2055 on: May 25, 2018, 06:17:02 am »
Unnecessary, we are already looking quite different. Spot who is who!



Lol Battle of the back yard vs marching to Moscow

Offline Riddlez

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2056 on: May 25, 2018, 09:26:52 am »
So what causes the difference? I guess Sean usus bleached cotton?

Well and they actually wash it
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Offline zac

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2057 on: May 25, 2018, 10:03:00 am »

Offline Duuring

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2058 on: May 25, 2018, 11:02:42 am »
We wash our linnen. But linnen isn't white. And in fact, the regulations specifically say the cloth must be grey', not white. So not just the fabric is wrong, so is the colour. 'It will get dirty', 'I just wash mine' and 'it's also correct' are just excuses.

Offline Riddlez

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2059 on: May 25, 2018, 12:14:05 pm »
Yeah do you have a set of (possibly translated) uniform manuals for me? Like in a digital file... I am going to have to start thinking about getting my own shit in the near future...


If that is you interpreting my remarks as hostile towards Casper you're wrong. I know next to nothing about the entire hobby and I am starting to feel like I am lagging behind.
In that regard it is more interesting to hang out with guys like Hans and Caspar and Olaf considering they have a little more knowledge about the whole thing.
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Offline Olafson

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2060 on: May 25, 2018, 12:20:23 pm »
Yeah, I do wash the linen trousers from time to time. Not after every even though, as that would be silly. But once or twice a year.

They are over trousers anyway, they are not official regulation issue for the time we portray. I.e. they are used to protect the real woolen breeches.
This is also the reason why they are so wide cut, they are supposed to fit another pair of trousers and gaiters underneath.

For the timeframe the 85e is potraying, their trousers are completely wrong though. For a Bardin Regulation impression 1813/14-15 you should either have long woolen trousers made out of tricot wool, or long linen trousers.
Their trousers are made from cotton and are high bleached.

Also cleaning your trousers would not have happened on campaign. They would have cleaned it from time to time, but really, people had better stuff to do than to care for their trousers.
Yes, on Garrison your trousers were expected to be clean, so was everything else. You were even expected to keep all your issued stuff (Can you imagine??) Anything that was missing had to be purchased back from your own money.

On campaign this is completely different. There are dozens of reports of soldiers throwing away half of their issued gear and instead opting for their own. They simply had no use for it. Officers during campaign usually did not care much about it, they completely accepted it. This goes even as far as regimental commanders supplying whole batches of shako-covers, catridgebox-covers, canteen-covers and overtrousers to the entire regiment.

The reason why Bardin opted for long trousers and shorter gaiters in 1812 was mainly due to the fact that he and everyone else knew that ordering breeches and long gaiters was a waste of money. People would just throw them away.

And linen trousers can look white when they are new, depending on what type of linen was used. Caspers new trousers for example are very grey, and will never look very close to a bright white. My trousers for example are fairly different.
Look at this photo from the first event I wore my new linen trousers:


They look pretty white, right? Still, this is nothing compared to those white cotton trousers everyone is wearing.
Oh btw. the grenadier on the left is wearing those long wool trousers that I was talking about earlier.

Offline Olafson

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2061 on: May 25, 2018, 12:25:25 pm »
Double post galore!

Yeah do you have a set of (possibly translated) uniform manuals for me? Like in a digital file... I am going to have to start thinking about getting my own shit in the near future...


If that is you interpreting my remarks as hostile towards Casper you're wrong. I know next to nothing about the entire hobby and I am starting to feel like I am lagging behind.
In that regard it is more interesting to hang out with guys like Hans and Caspar and Olaf considering they have a little more knowledge about the whole thing.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FhAmcYAlvqZ_YbntLpEbc9Wp-4eIWVsM

The 1812 Regulations are in there.

« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 12:28:58 pm by Olafson »

Offline Riddlez

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2062 on: May 25, 2018, 12:25:40 pm »
Quote
There are dozens of reports of soldiers throwing away half of their issued gear and instead opting for their own

200 years and nothing has changed XD



EDIT: oh sweet thank youu
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Offline Olafson

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2063 on: May 25, 2018, 12:28:48 pm »
Also, for your general informaiton, this guy does a 1812 impression and he has almost everything spot on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfsDL13Ua7E&feature=youtu.be

He has a part1 and part2, both are well made.

Offline zac

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2064 on: May 25, 2018, 12:34:58 pm »
Yeah do you have a set of (possibly translated) uniform manuals for me? Like in a digital file... I am going to have to start thinking about getting my own shit in the near future...


If that is you interpreting my remarks as hostile towards Casper you're wrong. I know next to nothing about the entire hobby and I am starting to feel like I am lagging behind.
In that regard it is more interesting to hang out with guys like Hans and Caspar and Olaf considering they have a little more knowledge about the whole thing.

I assure you it was entirely sarcastic haha, apologies if it was misinterpreted as otherwise. My french unit down here is part of the 21e so I am well aware of how dear Casper etc can come across <3 :') . And all good, i've been in the Napoleonic scene down here for over 10 years now and many ignore people like Capser, Olaf etc ,so it's good that you're all talking as they know there stuff :)
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 12:37:36 pm by zac »

Offline joer5835

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2065 on: May 25, 2018, 01:23:29 pm »
For the timeframe the 85e is potraying, their trousers are completely wrong though. For a Bardin Regulation impression 1813/14-15 you should either have long woolen trousers made out of tricot wool, or long linen trousers.
Their trousers are made from cotton and are high bleached.

Out of curiosity, do have any recommendations on where to get the correct linen trousers? Most suppliers I know of in the Netherlands and Germany can only get me cotton ones.

To play the devil's advocate a bit, a lot of people walk around with incorrect gear not because they don't care, but because they don't know any better. A lot of Reenactment units (and this goes for almost every unit not just the 85e) are really vague on what you need to get and from where. You get general directions and thats it, or even worse information that is so old its no longer useable (happened to me, I was instructed to buy a bicorne off a place that stopped making them years ago). The result is most people just buying things blindly and hoping its alright. When I joined the Equipage I was barely given instructions on what types of gear were acceptable and what where not. The result is that my trousers are also cotton because I was directed to buy 'white trousers' from Cooper's Choice and naturally he made me a pair of the cheapest and most common fabric he could find, because he didn't get any other instructions.

You could argue people should do their research better. Yeah, they could. But the reality is, is that some people have busy jobs. Working 9 to 5 every day in the week and having young kids means you don't always get time to do your own research and find the rights texts that instruct you on what gear to get. That's the point where the unit's main researcher (c'mon, every unit has one of those, most of us here are probbaly that guy) should step in and help people out. But often they don't, for whatever reason.

Reenactment would be improved a lot if people helped each other more to get started. Because way too often, people that just started out are completely lost and overwhelmed and sadly make the wrong decisions in those situations.
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Offline Riddlez

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2066 on: May 25, 2018, 01:37:42 pm »
It is these kinds of conversations that really help a guy like me.... thankfully I apparently know the right people here.
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Offline Duuring

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2067 on: May 25, 2018, 03:34:30 pm »
The problem is that some groups, when faced with the fact they do something wrong, tend to do just double-down. It's very little trouble ordering linnen instead of cotton, and even if you get a trouser made you can instruct your tailor you will purchase the fabric yourself. You're the customer. Coopers Choice is retardly expensive though.

I think it's also fair to say, and I mean no disrespect by this, that the equipage has fairly low authenticty standards in regards to their marines. I'm not surprised nobody told you what to get because I don't think anyone really cares.

It is these kinds of conversations that really help a guy like me.... thankfully I apparently know the right people here.

The thing is that Nico and me love to help people. Like, Nico was the person buying all the 85e buttons for the Dutch 85e (I think even for Joeri's coat?). But when people don't care... What can you do?
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 03:49:44 pm by Duuring »

Offline zac

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2068 on: May 25, 2018, 03:56:14 pm »
Someone mentioned cotton??  8)

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« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 04:33:27 pm by zac »

Offline joer5835

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Re: Let's discuss: Reenacting!
« Reply #2069 on: May 25, 2018, 04:06:13 pm »
Coopers Choice is retardly expensive though.

He's not that expensive. About the same prices as every other retailer that sells Paki premade stuff. His custom tailored stuff is also fine, it's more that he tends to take forever to finish an order and has a tendency to get measurements wrong.

I think it's also fair to say, and I mean no disrespect by this, that the equipage has fairly low authenticty standards in regards to their marines. I'm not surprised nobody told you what to get because I don't think anyone really cares.
It has improved the past few years but yes, it was really bad around the time I joined. For a while now, me and a few others have been pushing for more authenticity and we made some progress. I was the first to buy the correct model bicorne that we should have (although I still think it isn't perfect and I want to replace it with something even better, it's still vastly better than what we had) and got other members to join on that. Everyone finally has the correct black leather crossbelts for the 1806-1810 impression and are currently in the process of discovering if we should also use black for the 1790s kit, which we do highly suspect was the case. On top of that, I am slowly ditching my breadbag during battles and seeing where we can get some correct buttons made.

We're improving but yeah, we're not exactly employing high standards when it comes to authenticity.

Like, Nico was the person buying all the 85e buttons for the Dutch 85e (I think even for Joeri's coat?)
Correct, I received my habit-veste aout two weeks ago and have fitted Nico's correct buttons on it.
Polan is of dangerous to FSE
Im from Poland , a land of lawlessness