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Is Karth the GOAT?

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Author Topic: All-Time Leaders (NA)  (Read 27632 times)

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Offline Windflower

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #210 on: October 02, 2020, 05:40:05 am »
Tbh the reason Karth was so good was cause we trained a lot. Every other regiment I’ve been in has not come close to the amount of training and discipline than the 63e. It worked cause there wasn’t a lot of big egos in the 63e. Cause most people that think they’re too good to do line training were already in a different regiment. Nowadays you just have people not knowing what a wheel is or what a wing is. Pretty sad. Also some people still don’t know when reversing that turning left is faster than turning right.
Discipline in general was wayyy more popular back then and every ranker in the line took it 100% serious.. Line discipline in general is really important as it allows your line to move quicker and more cohesively without taking shots. Karth/63e definitely trained a lot in that regard which benefited them and gave them an advantage over other regiments.. until the meta kinda shifted away from having less disciplined regiments as people found it less enjoyable as the community grew smaller and shifted away from being 1v1-centric.

For real though you could argue less people know what a reverse-column is now or how to do one properly without losing cohesion because of that loss of discipline/line-discipline, everything is a lot sloppier.

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Offline ~NickCole~

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #211 on: October 02, 2020, 05:40:43 am »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2020, 05:50:09 am by -Nick »

Offline Eamon

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #212 on: October 02, 2020, 07:07:18 am »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.

6te did line formation training every night before every event for like 3 years before making it a comp only training. Shame we couldn't fight 63e more because we had like an hour and a half 1v1 against karth on 63e custom map and won 6-4.

Offline Wastee

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #213 on: October 02, 2020, 11:30:33 am »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them
« Last Edit: October 02, 2020, 11:33:57 am by Waste-Too-Cool »

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Offline Glenn

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #214 on: October 02, 2020, 11:48:39 am »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them

I gave Russian the idea of center form  8)
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Offline Wardop

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #215 on: October 02, 2020, 11:52:16 am »
Spoiler
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them
[close]
Yeah we had a stacked ass roster for sure but I don’t really know what I was thinking assuming I could step away from the game for ~6 years and hang with the best of them. Not doing a single training and having no discipline whatsoever probably didn’t help our case either. 6te leading was insane by any metric tho

Offline RussianFury

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #216 on: October 02, 2020, 04:21:27 pm »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them

I gave Russian the idea of center form  8)
No.

Offline Theodin

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #217 on: October 02, 2020, 05:25:38 pm »
Spoiler
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them

I gave Russian the idea of center form  8)
No.
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Offline John Price

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #218 on: October 02, 2020, 05:58:27 pm »
The idea of reverse columns etc. were a thing even back in Mount and Musket. I remember in the 84e we were required to learn this on our Sunday trainings and this was in 2011. You know how I remember this? Aldemar (84e Col) had a very German way of saying column, so he would say "reverse COLUMNAAA".

If I remember rightly most NA's played with EU regiments back then that if NA's werent doing even slightly complicated formations its because they just didn't, not because they didn't think of them or didn't know what they were.

Thats why on a list like this you give at least some props to good regiment leaders back then. They learned quickly whereas others were just ignorant.
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Offline Sleek

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #219 on: October 02, 2020, 06:26:08 pm »
Who needs formations and leaders

All will be dead by 9y
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Offline Pinoy12

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #220 on: October 02, 2020, 06:29:16 pm »
Who needs formations and leaders

All will be dead by 9y
honestly just charge like it's not that hard
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Offline Cytiuz

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #221 on: October 02, 2020, 07:14:21 pm »
The idea of reverse columns etc. were a thing even back in Mount and Musket. I remember in the 84e we were required to learn this on our Sunday trainings and this was in 2011. You know how I remember this? Aldemar (84e Col) had a very German way of saying column, so he would say "reverse COLUMNAAA".

If I remember rightly most NA's played with EU regiments back then that if NA's weren't doing even slightly complicated formations its because they just didn't, not because they didn't think of them or didn't know what they were.

Thats why on a list like this you give at least some props to good regiment leaders back then. They learned quickly whereas others were just ignorant.
That's fair to say. I pointed out in what I said that I think most old gen leaders would adjust to the era very well, but I don't like people comparing old gen leaders to new gen leaders. Different era of play. While most old gens paved the way for what it is today, they didn't do what we do today. Which makes them obsolete in this era by comparison on what we have seen, but that isn't saying none of them would adjust to the era well. I am sure many would. That can be with anything, comparing players from eras is like comparing apples to oranges, the whole New gen vs Old Gen argument is about as blunt, and stupid as it gets.

Offline Xethos

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #222 on: October 02, 2020, 08:37:53 pm »
Reverse columns? Center forming? Sounds like the product of discount single rank lines. Double rank army battles should have been the future.

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« Last Edit: October 03, 2020, 03:00:46 am by Xethos »
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Offline Stroke0fd34th

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #223 on: October 02, 2020, 08:49:31 pm »
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them


We most certainly did not have a better melee line up, even before the 1a collapsed after the first match against 6te, it was getting stomped by LG in groupfights lol (LG at that time was basically LG + 42nd so not surprising), was literally Rune and I trying to carry that melee against you, Yoshie, Cwater, Risk, Superbad, Pinoy, Fireboy, Theodin, BabyJ etc., most of our other top meleer's like Maple, Caribou and Grimsight weren't active, and everyone else was like Glenn level at best.

Grimsight and I also had 0 time to know or improve what we were working with regiment wise since we were tossed into leading roles like a few days before the match after 1a had a bit of an implosion following the 6te match. Kind of discovered that people didn't know how to not run beside the line and that reversing just caused horrendous blobs, couldn't do quick shooting etc. just wasn't a lot to work with at that time.

I think if we had more time to train the regiment and improve it, it would have been great, but we didn't.

But it eez what it eez

Offline Glenn

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Re: All-Time Leaders (NA)(2019)
« Reply #224 on: October 02, 2020, 09:01:58 pm »
Spoiler
wait this argument already happened git fukt 40th

still old gen reg biased imo
?

new gen leaders are kinda bad ngl
If you look at any 1v1s from like 2013, more then half the regs didn't know what a reverse was. As time goes regs don't get worse, they get better. I have had this argument with many people, and I have seen the best of both eras. If you get a new gen leader that is some-what league one material, they would absolutely crush regimental leaders who dropped off before 2015ish. Most of the high end old gen leaders would probably adjust to the era, but in terms of what is, and what was, the current era of leaders have adjusted from mistakes made in the earlier years. Tactics, and everything in general are just better. A good analogy for it would be in Baseball when people talk about Babe Ruth, while he was the best player of his era, and those years, he wouldn't be able to compete in this era, unless he took time to adjust to it. We saw something like this with Wardop when he reformed 1aSvea for the recent NANWL, he got dismantled in his first match, and the 1aSvea was disbanded half way into the season of NANWL, and even mid season he gave up his leading to more formidable leaders of the era.
Yeh Wardop was a bit rusty but its not hard for old leaders to start reverse columning in today's 1v1. When 1a 1v1 LG we lost 6-4 or 7-3 I think which isn't bad for his 1st time leading a 1v1 in like 6-7 years.
We 7-3ed 1aSvea when y’all arguably may have had a better melee lineup than us and I think Godfreid was leading. We were also missing Russian so I had a angry french canadian in the back

Long time ago tho details are fuzzy y’all imploded like a week later

Russian and I made center/front/back reforms cool and drilled the shit out of them before using them


We most certainly did not have a better melee line up, even before the 1a collapsed after the first match against 6te, it was getting stomped by LG in groupfights lol (LG at that time was basically LG + 42nd so not surprising), was literally Rune and I trying to carry that melee against you, Yoshie, Cwater, Risk, Superbad, Pinoy, Fireboy, Theodin, BabyJ etc., most of our other top meleer's like Maple, Caribou and Grimsight weren't active, and everyone else was like Glenn level at best.

Grimsight and I also had 0 time to know or improve what we were working with regiment wise since we were tossed into leading roles like a few days before the match after 1a had a bit of an implosion following the 6te match. Kind of discovered that people didn't know how to not run beside the line and that reversing just caused horrendous blobs, couldn't do quick shooting etc. just wasn't a lot to work with at that time.

I think if we had more time to train the regiment and improve it, it would have been great, but we didn't.

But it eez what it eez
[close]

you heard it here first folks I put the LG on my back


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