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The 2018 Federal Wide Legalization for the Recreational Use of Cannabis - Canada
StevenChilton:
--- Quote from: Vincenzo on August 31, 2017, 07:45:17 pm ---When the Netherlands legalised canabis, hasj, and magic mushrooms the criminality rates went down by 50%, that includes especially murders, there has not been a raise in mental illnesses and the average use per person of soft drugs compared to the countries around the Netherlands like Germany is at 25%.
Please tell me again how legalising it increases it's usage?
Most people here just give a shit, its legal, it's not special, nobody cares about it. only losers smoke it regulary, or people that need some fun can do it maybe in the weekend. Nobody is hurt from it, quality is much better than illegal shit.
/argument
--- End quote ---
Cannabis is not legal in the Netherlands and never has been, so your argument falls. Magic mushrooms are't legal either. It's simply decriminalised for personal use (having less than 5g on you, or growing 5 plants or less). It's still illegal in the Netherlands to buy, deal or cultivate cannabis.
Dutch polices on cannabis are actually stricter than in most parts of the UK. Here many police forces will turn a blind eye to it-you'd have to be carrying *a lot* more than 5g to be arrested. It's a bit of a lottery of course, some parts of the country do still rigorously enforce the law but most have de facto decriminalised.
What being proposed in Canada is very different-the drug will be fully legalised and thus commercialised. It will be advertised and sold openly the same as alcohol. That's not the same thing as simple toleration for personal use.
BabyJesus:
--- Quote from: Toffee Lad on August 31, 2017, 07:11:40 pm ---I heard it has implications to undeveloped brains i.e kids? Is that true? If so I would support it as long as it comes with an age restriction like alcohol and smoking.
--- End quote ---
Ive seen a couple of studies that said that. Up until like 25, it hurts brain development or something.
The age restriction, while I support it, is pretty useless tbh. It's kinda just there so the government can say they tried
Theodin:
While my position is closer to the decriminalization of it for personal use an interesting fact that a friend pointed out is that DUI rates related to marijuana increases as violent crime decreases in areas which legalize it.
George385:
--- Quote from: StevenChilton on August 31, 2017, 07:17:28 pm ---At a time when the evidence is pilling up regarding the link between cannabis use and mental illness, this is an insane policy. I don't know how any doctor could say this was a good idea. Also it clearly won't eliminate the black market-I'm assuming the Canadian government is going to tax it, limit THC content, and a variety of other restrictions. If there's a black market for tobacco and alcohol there will be for cannabis too.
--- End quote ---
There isn't a black market for tobacco and alcohol. Well, not legal alcohol and tobacco. There are alcoholic beverages that do have a black market, such as moonshine. And the traditional Cuban cigars are illegal because the whole leaf used in them can be used to extract cocaine. The black market surrounding cannabis is extremely expensive. To put it into perspective with tobacco, 50g of tobacco costs around $30 tops in Australia. 50g of cannabis costs around $600. Australia, having one of the highest tobacco tax rates in the world. The THC is staying the same.
There has been no evidence to support the direct link between cannabis use and the creation of mental illnesses. The only time I've seen cannabis negativity affect someone with a mental illness was a person who has schizophrenia. A condition that affects less than 1% of the population, so is it fair to punish the extreme majority for the less than 1%? Is it fair to deny all the other mental and physical illnesses that cannabis has been proven time and time again to help, such as depression and terminal illnesses like cancer for the ones who suffer from schizophrenia? I've seen first hand the effects of medicinal cannabis use on terminally ill patients. A family friend who was told by doctors that he had less than a year to live due to late stage cancer and prescribed him medicinal cannabis, he ended up seeing another decade. People who suffer from Parkinson's, and Alzheimer's, cannabis is proven to help. It relaxes the muscles.
The most dangerous drug in the world this year was alcohol. The safest, magic mushrooms. Whether you like it or not, the fact is that cannabis has never been named the direct result of any death in the history of ever. Historians have traced its usage back to Alexander the Great, many Roman emperors and even the Egyptian Pharaohs. It is mentioned in the bible at least 3 times, named the "Holy Leaf". Yet no records anywhere have ever linked any death with cannabis. It's impossible to overdose on, impossible to get addicted to (note the difference between dependency and addiction), and it has no proven long term health effects. The only effects it has is that it decreases focus and makes you a little paranoid. As long as you drive while intoxicated, there is zero evidence to suggest you will face anything negative.
Decriminalization is a very flawed concept. The only thing that is decriminalized is smoking it. Growing it, possessing it and selling it are still illegal and can result in jail time for first offenders in the USA.
If you want to spend $22 000 a year to throw someone in jail for a minimum of 2 years with rapists and murderers because they had a single joint in their hand then good for you, but you'll understand why other tax payers don't want their money going to such ridiculous things. You'll understand why others think that their money is much better used elsewhere, such as new hospital equipment or better pay for teachers or nurses, or anything else.
The industry in Canada is expected to grow to an industry worth over 4.5 billion dollars annually in under 5 years. How one can see any economical problems is totally beyond me.
StevenChilton:
--- Quote from: George385 on September 01, 2017, 07:08:38 am ---There isn't a black market for tobacco and alcohol. Well, not legal alcohol and tobacco.
--- End quote ---
I'm not sure what you mean when you say there isn't a black market for 'legal alcohol and tobacco'. If it's on the black market it cannot be legal. Tax something and you create a black market, and for tobacco it's worth perhaps as much as $3 billion in Ontario alone.
--- Quote from: George385 on September 01, 2017, 07:08:38 am ---There has been no evidence to support the direct link between cannabis use and the creation of mental illnesses.
--- End quote ---
Yes there has been.
http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/healthadvice/problemsdisorders/cannabis.aspx
--- Quote from: George385 on September 01, 2017, 07:08:38 am ---The most dangerous drug in the world this year was alcohol. The safest, magic mushrooms. Whether you like it or not, the fact is that cannabis has never been named the direct result of any death in the history of ever.
--- End quote ---
You're right, it hasn't killed anyone, just given a lot of people irreversible mental illness and who now spend their time on a locked ward in a mental hospital. I'd prefer death to that.
--- Quote from: George385 on September 01, 2017, 07:08:38 am ---The industry in Canada is expected to grow to an industry worth over 4.5 billion dollars annually in under 5 years. How one can see any economical problems is totally beyond me.
--- End quote ---
The tobacco industry also paid a lot in taxation. How much is Canada going to need to spend expanding mental health facilities though? How many taxpayers will be lost to the locked wards of mental hospitals? Sounds like it could be a false economy.
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