Battlefield Muscians: A Few Historical Questions

[Moldplayer]

Hello ladies and gentlemen. It is time for another of my historical questions.

Musicians, love them or hate them, they are a common sight in Mount and Blade Napoleonic Wars. Drummers and buglers are often compared to modern day radiomen bringing order and control for the officer in the heat of battle. They of course through their music helped relay commands to the rest of the line from the officer. Drummers for for line infantry and buglers for light infantry and cavalry. However in the line of battle where would they be placed? That is, when the firing started where would you find the musician? Secondly I ask when it came to assault a position, whether it be at the walls of Smolensk or Hougomont, what would a musician be expected to do? I have heard some highly anecdotal evidence that they would be tending the wounded in the rear, and that killing a musician was frowned upon, but this does not make too much sense.

Finally; what about flutists and bagpipers? Did they play any role in battle, and when?

So where would a musician be in the battle, and if it came to a assault on a position what would they do? Please use genuine historical info from books rather then anecdotal evidence from videos games or forums.

[Millander]

I doubt killing of musicians was frowned upon. People has a false idea about the amount of honor on the battlefield in those times. Battle is a disgusting gory deaphening and unglorious mess. I doubt there was much care about if the enemies musicians were killed although im sure the guys shooting back were more preferable. 

 Im sure their function varied by nation in the Napoleonic Wars. In the civil war musicians were almost universally employed as stretcher bearers to assist with the wounded.

[IchDien]

I doubt killing of musicians was frowned upon.

Even if they were kids? I suppose the distinction wouldn't exist on land as much as it didn't at sea, at the time.

[Millander]

Largely the situation I would assume.

There is a very publicized account of the Coldstream accounts sparing the life of a French Drummer Boy at Hougomont. There is as well a French account from an officer of the 45e Regiment de Ligne describing the drummer boys of his battalion being mercilessly cut down when his regiment was receiving the charge of the British Scots Greys at the same battle. 

[Moldplayer]

Yeah again it comes down to the battle and situation.

[Mr T]

Regimental children could become fifers or other regimental band members when they reached the age of 14, then sign up as a soldier in the regiment at 16.

In a battalion of a regiment, each company had 2 tambours, they were usually men but in the later years I expect young boys became drummers in the later yearss 1813-15.
When the battalion was formed together, say in line of battle, all the tambours formed together behind the centre of the line.
The most important musicians were the drummers, they beat the orders in both battle and garrison. They beat the rythem of march, the charge, the retreat, the assembly etc.
The regimental bands were mostly for parade and ceremony but were utilised in battle at the Colonel's whim, for example the band of the 23e Regiment d'Infanterie de Ligne played La Chant du Depart as the French began their attack on St Amand at the Battle of Ligny 1815.

[Von_Clausewitz]

Finally; what about flutists and bagpipers? Did they play any role in battle, and when?

Pipers were scarce, and most regiments probably only had one or two (they were not on the muster roll, they were usually 'recruited' through one of the many Scottish clans. Naturally, they still received pay, but usually they were paid by the officers themselves and not by government (Only in 1854, presumable under Victoria's influence, the War Office authorised five pipers and a pipe major). Many people seem to think regiments like the Black Watch had rows and rows of pipers marching them into battle. This is far from the truth, the marching bands(?) consisted out of flutists and drummers, some of these flute tunes were transferred to the pipes but most of the pipe music you know today (Scotland the Brave etc.) were not played during these times, simply because most of these tunes found their origin around the late 1800's (or were first published around this time, therefore we don't know whether or not some tunes were/weren't played). Like I said, the pipers most likely played variations on different piobaireachd and the occasional traditional tunes. Now that is not to say that pipers were not in the heat of the battle, there are several cases where pipers are credited for their bravery in battle. 'Cogadh na Sith' (Piobaireachd) is famous for having been played at Waterloo by Piper Mackay on the pipes now in the Piping Centre museum, while MacKay marched around outside the square of the 79th as they waited for Marshall Ney's cavalry charge. There is a story of highlanders being 'dragged' into battle by holding onto the Scots Grey's horses whilst a piper played Johnny Cope, whether this is true or not is to be debated. Then again, pipers were scarce and I doubt many of them were put right in the middle of the action simply because it was probably a pain in the ass to replace them (In WW1 this practice was common too, many of the pipers were kept away from the front lines by their respective officers, then again some weren't and over a 1000 pipers of the more than 2500 who served died).

An example of piobaireachd:

Spoiler

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8HvAMB1Bv8&spfreload=10[/youtube]

[close]

I found something I posted a while ago about the origin of some tunes and whether they were played during the Napoleonic Wars;

Turns out Skye Boat Song cannot be traced back to a source earlier than the 1880s according to Dr. William Donaldson (author of The Highland Pipe and Scottish Society, I contacted him about the matter) and the tune (most likely all of the tunes) in the game is therefore historically inaccurate and most definitely wasn't played during the Napoleonic Wars. History on the pipers during the Napoleonic Wars is very scarce, let alone trying to find something about the music they played. I suggest you read The Highland Pipe and Scottish Society and David Murray's excellent book on the Music of the Scottish Regiments, if you'd want to find out more about the music being played in/before/after the Napoleonic Wars by pipers. Then again, these books are a bit technical and might be unappealing to people who don't play the pipes. If you're really interested you might wanna check them out.

[Moldplayer]

Thankyou for the information Gentlemen.

[Duuring]

The story about Highlanders holding onto the stirrups of the Scots Greys is nothing more then a legend. It is presumed the story was made up to protect the reputation of the Greys; what actually happened is that cavalry rode over a Highlander flank-company by accident.

[Josh Faraday]

The story about Highlanders holding onto the stirrups of the Scots Greys is nothing more then a legend. It is presumed the story was made up to protect the reputation of the Greys; what actually happened is that cavalry rode over a Highlander flank-company by accident.

rly?

[Mr T]

Yeah, your first instinct when your getting run over by your own cavalry isn't to grab onto their stirrups, it's either hit the ground or get trampled, probably both happened anyway.

[Duuring]

And holding on to the stirrups of a horse would quite probably knock them over. Besides, it's kinda hard to keep hundreds of men and horses in formation if 50 highlanders have mixed in.

[Andrix]

I have always wondered if they could play every note the correct way in the heat of battle. People are falling dead next to you, and there you are, playing some motivational music - must have been awkward X)

[Duuring]

They didn't, really. Field musicians would play commands, and band members often stayed fááár behind.

[Andrix]

Well, that makes sense.