Game of Thrones thread (USE SPOILERS)

[John Price]

Spoiler

The much more imporant question is... What did Dorne the Reach and Daenerys/Varys agree on? I doubt Daenerys wants to loose like 50% of Westeros for a few ships... She already gave away the Iron Islands. Now she is going to give away the Reach and Dorne? Sounds retarded...

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I think you misread the story. She does not want to conquer Westeros, she wants to conquer the Iron throne and command the respect of all the other houses as her family did for 300 years. If they do not kneel they die. Dorne and the Reach have kneel'd. She is not giving them away she is making sure she gets the same goal without having to throw away her army.

[Audiate]

Spoiler

But let's not forget, Aegon was desperate to make a long standing foothold in Westeros, and who's to say he knew Hoare was a tyrant? He saw a massive castle, unlike anything else in Westeros and Essos (Valyria... maybe), and he burnt it. That gains the respect of people no matter who's living there.

Anyway, he was also willing to burn Oldtown to the ground, but just as he did with the Storm King Argillac and Harren the Black, he warned the leaders first, only Oldtown and the Hightowers and the High Septon knelt for him. That was only after he burned down the greatest castle ever built in Westeros, burned down the most impressive army in Westeros made by a pact between the Rock (Lannisters) and the Reach (Gardeners at the time), and installed his pal, who was likely his step brother by the way, as ruler of the Stormlands (Baratheon is a Valyrian name, the sigil and words are Westerosi, adopted from the previous Storm Kings, the Durrandons). So I'm sure people from then on learned to kneel, but if Argillac was arrogant and Harlen Hoare a tyrant, what does it really matter to a conqueror? The books are written as if the histories were written by the victors anyway.

(I'm just adding a lot of lore stuff for the people who probably haven't read World or much of the lore yet.)

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Spoiler

The much more imporant question is... What did Dorne the Reach and Daenerys/Varys agree on? I doubt Daenerys wants to loose like 50% of Westeros for a few ships... She already gave away the Iron Islands. Now she is going to give away the Reach and Dorne? Sounds retarded...

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Spoiler

No, Dorne and the Reach both lack strong leadership, now more than ever, and are both at odds against the Lannisters. If they combine their resources to help a Targaryen, who has tons of experience leading, has a pretty good council at her side (including one of the smartest, albeit most hated, dwarf person in Westeros), and three dragons, which are all bigger than any living dragons in the east had been for like a hundred and fifty years, they can topple down the Lannisters and reunify the realm, putting away with its many issues.

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Spoiler

I think at this point, Jon will become the King of the North, his heir would be Sansa, Danny unifies the realm, something happens to her, they need an heir, Jon's true identity comes out, Jon inherits the throne after beating the white walkers with Danny and Tyrion (this is how everyone would learn about Jon's exploits), and the realm lives on with Tyrion in Casterly Rock, Sansa in Winterfell, Robert Arryn in the Vale, maybe Sansa/Baelish/Edmure in the Riverlands, Edric Storm/Gendry for the show in Storm's End, who-the-fuck-cares-anymore in Dorne, everyone-is-dead in the Reach, and hell, the Ironborn might just tuck in their tails and join the throne, whoever leads them.

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[Gokiller]

Spoiler

But let's not forget, Aegon was desperate to make a long standing foothold in Westeros, and who's to say he knew Hoare was a tyrant? He saw a massive castle, unlike anything else in Westeros and Essos (Valyria... maybe), and he burnt it. That gains the respect of people no matter who's living there.

Anyway, he was also willing to burn Oldtown to the ground, but just as he did with the Storm King Argillac and Harren the Black, he warned the leaders first, only Oldtown and the Hightowers and the High Septon knelt for him. That was only after he burned down the greatest castle ever built in Westeros, burned down the most impressive army in Westeros made by a pact between the Rock (Lannisters) and the Reach (Gardeners at the time), and installed his pal, who was likely his step brother by the way, as ruler of the Stormlands (Baratheon is a Valyrian name, the sigil and words are Westerosi, adopted from the previous Storm Kings, the Durrandons). So I'm sure people from then on learned to kneel, but if Argillac was arrogant and Harlen Hoare a tyrant, what does it really matter to a conqueror? The books are written as if the histories were written by the victors anyway.

(I'm just adding a lot of lore stuff for the people who probably haven't read World or much of the lore yet.)

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I wasn't talking about Aegon's perspective, but the one of the other lords of Westeros. The point that nearly no one cared about "Harren the Black" being burned alive along with his castle. Because those lords probably knew what Harren and his ironborn folk were like.

(Just speculation obvs, considering it's never mentioned how other lords actually thought about him except for the Riverlords)

[Olafson]

Spoiler

Alright good argument, I didn't think about the fact that they might actually just want to kneel and not be independant.

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[Furrnox]

Spoiler

I'm pretty sure Dorne & the Tyrells joined Daenarys only for revenge really.

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[junedragon]

Spoiler

I'm pretty sure Dorne & the Tyrells joined Daenarys only for revenge really.

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Spoiler

To be fair they both remained loyal to the Targaryens straight up to the Trident and fall of King's Landing.

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[Olafson]

Spoiler

The Reach is a major naval power in the books.

Spoiler

Tbh, I don't think there are more then 100-200 ships in that last shot. Let's just assume that they're doing away with logic at this point.

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These guys have counted: http://www.thewrap.com/game-of-thrones-finale-how-many-ships-were-in-daenerys-fleet/

There are 350 ships in that shot. And let's not forget that the fleet does not end at the horizon.

Actually, I just looked at it again, and the fleet DOES END before the horizon.



Red is where the tip of the sails are, blue is where the horizon is. It does not extend to the horizon and it certainly does not go beyond it.
I did not count the ships, but they say it is 350.
I assume that about 100 guys are on each of those ships. Which is probbaly not the case... I tried to count the guys on GreyWorms ship and there are only about 39 Guys on the ship. Additionally, the ships are not specially large, and the guys on top of the ship do not seem to be specially crowded. In Terms of the Dothraki it is clearly less than 100 guys on each ship, the horses take almost all the space.
But just for fun, lets just assume each ship has 100 guys.

That "only" makes it to 35k Soldiers. Which is still insanely huge.

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[Gokiller]

Spoiler

Alright good argument, I didn't think about the fact that they might actually just want to kneel and not be independant.

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Never suggested anything like that. But alright.

[Gluk the Walrus]

Spoiler

The Reach is a major naval power in the books.

Spoiler

Tbh, I don't think there are more then 100-200 ships in that last shot. Let's just assume that they're doing away with logic at this point.

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These guys have counted: http://www.thewrap.com/game-of-thrones-finale-how-many-ships-were-in-daenerys-fleet/

There are 350 ships in that shot. And let's not forget that the fleet does not end at the horizon.

Actually, I just looked at it again, and the fleet DOES END before the horizon.



Red is where the tip of the sails are, blue is where the horizon is. It does not extend to the horizon and it certainly does not go beyond it.
I did not count the ships, but they say it is 350.
I assume that about 100 guys are on each of those ships. Which is probbaly not the case... I tried to count the guys on GreyWorms ship and there are only about 39 Guys on the ship. Additionally, the ships are not specially large, and the guys on top of the ship do not seem to be specially crowded. In Terms of the Dothraki it is clearly less than 100 guys on each ship, the horses take almost all the space.
But just for fun, lets just assume each ship has 100 guys.

That "only" makes it to 35k Soldiers. Which is still insanely huge.

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Spoiler

Could be ships behind the camera shot, could be ships to the right and left of the camera shot. Who knows how many more ships there could be.

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[Duuring]

They're too close to eachother anyway. They're stealing eachother's wind.

[Earth Bby]

@FSE_Olafson

Spoiler

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[Ted]

They're too close to eachother anyway. They're stealing eachother's wind.

Let's keep discussing about how the close formation of the ships takes away the wind from a fleet that is led by a magic women that can resist fire and has 3 dragons.

[Duuring]

Fantasy books that use 'muh magic' to fix holes in basic logic are the worst kind of fantasy.

[Ambiguous]

Fantasy books that use 'muh magic' to fix holes in basic logic are the worst kind of fantasy.

[Furrnox]

Spoiler

Aegon the Conquerer burned down the greatest castle Westeros had every seen and the greatest army Westeros had every seen at that time, and his dynasty ruled for nearly 300 years. Danny can get away with a couple torchings.

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Yeah but the thing is, the house that owned the castle he burned (Harrenhall) was notorious for being tyrants. Enslaving the Riverlands to build himself the biggest castle. Except the Ironborn themselves perhaps, no one else cared about the death of House Hoare. I could only imagine other great houses being happy about it. And I don't believe he burned any other castles/cities beside Harrenhall.

But.

show-related

I agree, if Daenarys would decide to burn the one after the other city and castle. She wouldn't particularly do well. Neither do I think that something like that will ever happen. Considering Tyron is wise enough to advice her against such actions. However, it's possible that they will burn Kingslanding and perhaps some lannister holds. Depending on how crazy Cersei goes.

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Spoiler

I highly doubt she'd like to burn Kingslanding.

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