Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned

[TheRedRedcoat]

I think the CSA is pretty tyrannical considering they were fighting for slavery. Slavery is pretty bad, in my opinion.

NO NO. DIDNT YOU READ. IT WAS FOR STATES RIGHTS. SEE ROBERT E LEE HATED SLAVERY. THEY ALL DID. IT WAS FOR STATES RIGHTS11!!1!!1!1

[Nipplestockings]

Yeah, especially when the top states right they were fighting for was the institution of slavery itself lol. It's so funny how they trip over themselves trying to justify their bourgeois rebellion. Sad for the brave CSA soldiers who died deceived and manipulated. Same for the Union.

[usnavy30]

in my opinion the modern american flag represents a tyrannical, war mongering nation.

lets ban it 

How was the CSA war mongering? They played a defensive war trying to keep the union out of the CSA states, and the only reason they went to war is that after seceding (at that point it was completely within their right to secede) the Union refused to remove their troops from the forts on CSA land. And they Seceded because they believed the new president (Lincoln) was going to take their economies foundation away (slavery). They were not war monger or tyrannical. They supported States rights so technically wouldn't the USA be more tyrannical then the CSA because the USA supported a strong central government instead of strong states rights.

Rabbit was moreso making a touche reply. He was most likely talking about the Union in particular, as the modern national flag of the U.S. today. The flawed logic being if a flag is a part of a war mongering nation then it can be deemed ban-able. Which I hope was sarcasm IMHO. Then the logic to ban a flag because it represents something people do not like, let alone something that some people find offensive. I find it rather grasping at straws that caused this whole controversy in the first place. K.K.K. members use the Confederate flag and some people call it racist because of the association the KKK made with the flag usage. The flag itself is a battle flag for crying out loud. So what it is affiliated with the CSA, some people want to outright erase history now? It seems deliberate and one-sided to make this a controversy. Maybe some people cannot handle history itself. He was making the case with that logic the U.S. flag should be banned in sarcasm as the U.S. was a war-mongering nation in the past. Recent wars may be debated as war-mongering. So in short Rabbit's reply was simply a touche remark to ponder. Just my two cents.

[TheDoctor]

Spoiler

in my opinion the modern american flag represents a tyrannical, war mongering nation.

lets ban it 

How was the CSA war mongering? They played a defensive war trying to keep the union out of the CSA states, and the only reason they went to war is that after seceding (at that point it was completely within their right to secede) the Union refused to remove their troops from the forts on CSA land. And they Seceded because they believed the new president (Lincoln) was going to take their economies foundation away (slavery). They were not war monger or tyrannical. They supported States rights so technically wouldn't the USA be more tyrannical then the CSA because the USA supported a strong central government instead of strong states rights.

Rabbit was moreso making a touche reply. He was most likely talking about the Union in particular, as the modern national flag of the U.S. today. The flawed logic being if a flag is a part of a war mongering nation then it can be deemed ban-able. Which I hope was sarcasm IMHO. Then the logic to ban a flag because it represents something people do not like, let alone something that some people find offensive. I find it rather grasping at straws that caused this whole controversy in the first place. K.K.K. members use the Confederate flag and some people call it racist because of the association the KKK made with the flag usage. The flag itself is a battle flag for crying out loud. So what it is affiliated with the CSA, some people want to outright erase history now? It seems deliberate and one-sided to make this a controversy. Maybe some people cannot handle history itself. He was making the case with that logic the U.S. flag should be banned in sarcasm as the U.S. was a war-mongering nation in the past. Recent wars may be debated as war-mongering. So in short Rabbit's reply was simply a touche remark to ponder. Just my two cents.

[close]

Did you all know Hitler supported multiple instances of burning books and other historical documents in an attempt to erase any history that went against his ideals? Just a few weeks ago a group of people petitioned to remove all battle flags of northern VA from all CSA gravestones and to tear down the "Stonewall" Jackson monument because they claimed both were racist. Luckily the courts in northern VA denied their claim (because it was ridiculous)  but if we were to follow in hitler's footsteps by attempting to erase history wouldn't that make us like a tyrant? Also in regards to the comment before USnavys on the CSA fighting for slavery. Slavery was not outlawed in the south prior to the civil war and the war was not over slavery until after the emancipation. Also it was not a rebellion at all, because the states legally had a right to leave the "packed" known as the constitution if they thought the federal government was exceeding its boundaries. The southern states believed this and left. They declared war on the union after the union refused to recall its troops from forts based in the south. So it was not a rebellion over slavery but instead the south was defending itself from an invading force that refused to leave. This is much like the british after the american revolution who refused to pull their men out of the forts in the great lake area forcing the new US to attack them and the native tribes supporting them.

[TheRedRedcoat]

Spoiler

Spoiler

in my opinion the modern american flag represents a tyrannical, war mongering nation.

lets ban it 

How was the CSA war mongering? They played a defensive war trying to keep the union out of the CSA states, and the only reason they went to war is that after seceding (at that point it was completely within their right to secede) the Union refused to remove their troops from the forts on CSA land. And they Seceded because they believed the new president (Lincoln) was going to take their economies foundation away (slavery). They were not war monger or tyrannical. They supported States rights so technically wouldn't the USA be more tyrannical then the CSA because the USA supported a strong central government instead of strong states rights.

Rabbit was moreso making a touche reply. He was most likely talking about the Union in particular, as the modern national flag of the U.S. today. The flawed logic being if a flag is a part of a war mongering nation then it can be deemed ban-able. Which I hope was sarcasm IMHO. Then the logic to ban a flag because it represents something people do not like, let alone something that some people find offensive. I find it rather grasping at straws that caused this whole controversy in the first place. K.K.K. members use the Confederate flag and some people call it racist because of the association the KKK made with the flag usage. The flag itself is a battle flag for crying out loud. So what it is affiliated with the CSA, some people want to outright erase history now? It seems deliberate and one-sided to make this a controversy. Maybe some people cannot handle history itself. He was making the case with that logic the U.S. flag should be banned in sarcasm as the U.S. was a war-mongering nation in the past. Recent wars may be debated as war-mongering. So in short Rabbit's reply was simply a touche remark to ponder. Just my two cents.

[close]

Did you all know Hitler supported multiple instances of burning books and other historical documents in an attempt to erase any history that went against his ideals? Just a few weeks ago a group of people petitioned to remove all battle flags of northern VA from all CSA gravestones and to tear down the "Stonewall" Jackson monument because they claimed both were racist. Luckily the courts in northern VA denied their claim (because it was ridiculous)  but if we were to follow in hitler's footsteps by attempting to erase history wouldn't that make us like a tyrant? Also in regards to the comment before USnavys on the CSA fighting for slavery. Slavery was not outlawed in the south prior to the civil war and the war was not over slavery until after the emancipation. Also it was not a rebellion at all, because the states legally had a right to leave the "packed" known as the constitution if they thought the federal government was exceeding its boundaries. The southern states believed this and left. They declared war on the union after the union refused to recall its troops from forts based in the south. So it was not a rebellion over slavery but instead the south was defending itself from an invading force that refused to leave. This is much like the british after the american revolution who refused to pull their men out of the forts in the great lake area forcing the new US to attack them and the native tribes supporting them.

[close]

Uh. Not really. The south seceded because they didn't like the person who was elected as president. It's the same idea as all of the states that voted for Romney seceding after Obama won. The bone of contention between the north and south was slavery at its core. The spread of slavery was a large issue because more slave states = more pro slavery representatives in congress. The south was alright with staying in the union under the condition it could own slaves. Once it saw the walls closing in, they thought it was time for them to leave. 

[Karth]

Lol I have an ancestor on my maternal side who fought for the Confederacy.  And I know he was a racist like everyone else there, so honestly the flag should stay banned. 

[TheRedRedcoat]

Tbh I don't even think the flag should be banned. It's freedom of expression. I just hate this bullshit about causes of the war. It was slavery. Deal with it. It wasn't this noble gentleman's war southerners like to think it is. They were fighting for their right to keep other humans in bondage.

[AP0CALYPS3]

muh flag

also the war itself was about states rights redcoat, one of which happened to be slavery. alot of people tend to overlook another huge cause was the north tarriffing the shit out of goods in the south, making it extremely hard for the south to trade with foreign powers and allowed the north to charge really high prices for their goods, which was a product of another major problem that the souths opinion was totally overriden in politics (Lincoln literally got elected without the south voting for him at all) . the civil war also wasnt the first time states had gotten outraged over states rights, the first (besides you know, the whole scrapping of the articles of confederation and rhode island being scrublords) was actually at around 1812 when the north eastern states actually threatened to leave the union due to james madison bein a bitch (but its such a horrible thing if the south threatens to leave due to them thinking Lincoln looks like a bitch) also andrew jackson being divisive as fuck at the beginning of the 19th century also didnt help.

[TheDoctor]

Lol I have an ancestor on my maternal side who fought for the Confederacy.  And I know he was a racist like everyone else there, so honestly the flag should stay banned.

Well you must think of the time as well. Slavery for many years was seen as a just thing and in the south even after the civil war many citizens still saw slavery as their right. You must also look at Lincoln and many of the abolitionists...Did they believe there should be no more slavery? yes, but they still saw themselves better then black men. Lincoln even said at one point "I if I see a fight between and alligator and a black man I will help the black man, but if I see a fight between a black man and a white man I will help the white man" which shows at least to today's standard of racists, that he was a racist. The idea of racism must be viewed in relative nature to the time period in which the so called "racist" was raised. Also I do think de to the flag's uses in KKK and other radical groups (not because it was a CSA battle flag) it should remain ban here; however, the CSA state flag and other battle flags should be fine to fly where ever people want them to.

[Bob_Rabbit]

in my opinion the modern american flag represents a tyrannical, war mongering nation.

lets ban it 

How was the CSA war mongering? They played a defensive war trying to keep the union out of the CSA states, and the only reason they went to war is that after seceding (at that point it was completely within their right to secede) the Union refused to remove their troops from the forts on CSA land. And they Seceded because they believed the new president (Lincoln) was going to take their economies foundation away (slavery). They were not war monger or tyrannical. They supported States rights so technically wouldn't the USA be more tyrannical then the CSA because the USA supported a strong central government instead of strong states rights.

i was talking about the current american flag, not the CSA one 

[TheDoctor]

in my opinion the modern american flag represents a tyrannical, war mongering nation.

lets ban it 

How was the CSA war mongering? They played a defensive war trying to keep the union out of the CSA states, and the only reason they went to war is that after seceding (at that point it was completely within their right to secede) the Union refused to remove their troops from the forts on CSA land. And they Seceded because they believed the new president (Lincoln) was going to take their economies foundation away (slavery). They were not war monger or tyrannical. They supported States rights so technically wouldn't the USA be more tyrannical then the CSA because the USA supported a strong central government instead of strong states rights.

i was talking about the current american flag, not the CSA one 

Lets all go to Texas and succeed and form the Texas Republic once again.

[JesterJc]

I personally don't think it should be banned, its freedom of speech and the supreme court should have stepped in and said that. In the Skokie case of 1977. The supreme court ruled that the the Swastika was representing freedom of speech.

National Socialist Party of America v. Skokie, Illinois historical info:

Spoiler

In the 1977 case, the National Socialist Party of America wanted to hold a Nazi rally, law enforcement stepped in and stopped it. Keep in mind Skokie is a dominantly Jewish town. This case went all the way to the supreme court and the supreme court ruled that the Swastika itself is a form of freedom of speech.

[close]

If they allow the Swastika to be allowed as a freedom of speech then I think that the flag should be allowed to fly wherever it wants to be flown. It's also the fact, do we want to get rid of the flag and erase that part of our past? I don't think it should be banned also because it represents a civil war that took place roughly 85 year after the birth of the USA. It should stand to remind us not to go down that path again.

Plus the Civil War was a huge help in in the end of slavery (I know that the civil war didn't officially end slavery, but it put us on the path). Great Britain was the first country to end the slave trade. Then things like the Haitian revolution and our own civil war helped put the world on the path to no slavery. Also keep in mind that before the triangle trade of the Atlantic, slavery was not based upon race.

Okay I'm done rambling. If you want to talk more about to find me or reply or something.

Also sorry to revive this dead thread, I was scrolling through and saw it, I read through some of it and wanted to say something.

[TheDoctor]

I personally don't think it should be banned, its freedom of speech and the supreme court should have stepped in and said that. In the Skokie case of 1977. The supreme court ruled that the the Swastika was representing freedom of speech.

National Socialist Party of America v. Skokie, Illinois historical info:

Spoiler

In the 1977 case, the National Socialist Party of America wanted to hold a Nazi rally, law enforcement stepped in and stopped it. Keep in mind Skokie is a dominantly Jewish town. This case went all the way to the supreme court and the supreme court ruled that the Swastika itself is a form of freedom of speech.

[close]

If they allow the Swastika to be allowed as a freedom of speech then I think that the flag should be allowed to fly wherever it wants to be flown. It's also the fact, do we want to get rid of the flag and erase that part of our past? I don't think it should be banned also because it represents a civil war that took place roughly 85 year after the birth of the USA. It should stand to remind us not to go down that path again.

Plus the Civil War was a huge help in in the end of slavery (I know that the civil war didn't officially end slavery, but it put us on the path). Great Britain was the first country to end the slave trade. Then things like the Haitian revolution and our own civil war helped put the world on the path to no slavery. Also keep in mind that before the triangle trade of the Atlantic, slavery was not based upon race.

Okay I'm done rambling. If you want to talk more about to find me or reply or something.

Also sorry to revive this dead thread, I was scrolling through and saw it, I read through some of it and wanted to say something.

Just let this thread die, it will never be changed.

[Nick Lazanis]

Let him express himself. He made some interesting points. Yeah it will most probably never be changed,but it's good if he posted. Got it off his chest.

[Dazzer]

I honestly dont care