Author Topic: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned  (Read 43209 times)

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Offline Fives53544

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #195 on: July 02, 2015, 04:20:16 am »
Get ready for another civil war after the 2016 elections.
Republican all the way.

Offline Alistair

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #196 on: July 02, 2015, 01:37:01 pm »
Spoiler
MYTH  -   The War of 1861 - 1865 was fought over slavery.

FACT  -   Terribly untrue. The North fought the war over money. Plain and simple. When the South started Secession, Lincoln was asked, "Why not let the South go in peace?" To which he replied, "I can't let them go. Who would pay for the government?" Sensing total financial ruin for the North, Lincoln waged war on the South. The South fought the War to repel Northern aggression and invasion.


MYTH  -   Only Southerners owned slaves.

FACT  -   Entirely untrue. Many Northern civilians owned slaves. Prior to, during and even after the War Of Northern Aggression.

Surprisingly, to many history impaired individuals, most Union Generals and staff had slaves to serve them! William T. Sherman had many slaves that served him until well after the war was over and did not free them until late in 1865.

U.S. Grant also had several slaves, who were only freed after the 13th amendment in December of 1865. When asked why he didn't free his slaves earlier, Grant stated "Good help is so hard to come by these days."

Contrarily, Confederate General Robert E. Lee freed his slaves (which he never purchased - they were inherited) in 1862!!! Lee freed his slaves several years before the war was over, and considerably earlier than his Northern counterparts. And during the fierce early days of the war when the South was obliterating the Yankee armies!

Lastly, and most importantly, why did NORTHERN States outlaw slavery only AFTER the war was over? The so-called "Emancipation Proclamation" of Lincoln only gave freedom to slaves in the SOUTH! NOT in the North! This pecksniffery even went so far as to find the state of Delaware rejecting the 13th Amendment in December of 1865 and did not ratify it (13th Amendment / free the slaves) until 1901!


MYTH  -   The Confederate Battle Flag was flown on slave ships.

FACT  -   NONE of the flags of the Confederacy or Southern Nation ever flew over a slave ship. Nor did the South own or operate any slaves ships. The English, the Dutch and the Portugese brought slaves to this country, not the Southern Nation.

BUT, even more monumental, it is also very important to know and understand that Federal, Yankee, Union ships brought slaves to America! These ships were from the New England states, and their hypocrisy is atrocious.

These Federals were ones that ended up crying the loudest about slavery. But without their ships, many of the slaves would have never arrived here. They made countless fortunes on the delivery of slaves as well as the products madefrom raw materials such as cotton and tobacco in the South.

This is the problem with Yankee history History is overwhelmingly portrayed incorrectly by most of the Federal & Yankee books and media.


MYTH  -   The Confederate Battle Flag represented the Southern Nation.

FACT  -   Not true. While the Southern Battle flag was carried into battle, the Southern Nation had 3 different National flags during the course of the war.

The First National flag was changed due to a resemblance of the US flag.

The Second National flag was subsequently modified due to the similarity to a flag of truce.

The Third National flag was the adopted flag of the Confederacy.

The Confederate Battle Flag was never a National Flag of the Confederacy. It was carried into battle by several armies such as the Army Of Northen Virginia and the Army of Tennessee. Was also used as a Naval Jack by the Confederate Navy.


MYTH  -   The Confederate Battle Flag is known as the "Stars & Bars".

FACT  -   A common misconception. The First National Confederate Flag is correctly known as the "Stars & Bars". The Confederate Battle Flag is known as the "Southern Cross".


MYTH  -   The Confederate Battle Flag represents racism today.

FACT  -   The Confederate Battle Flag today finds itself in the center of much controversy and hoopla going on in several states. The cry to take this flag down is unjustified. It is very important to keep in mind that the Confederate Battle Flag was simply just that. A battle flag. It was never even a National flag, so how could it have flown over a slave nation or represented slavery or racism? This myth is continued by lack of education and ignorance. Those that villify the Confederate Battle Flag are very confused about history and have jumped upon a bandwagon with loose wheels.


MYTH  -   The United States Flag represented freedom.

FACT  -   No chance. The US flag flew over a slave nation for over 85 years! The North tolerated slavery and acknowledged it as a Division Of Labor. The North made a vast fortune on slavery and it's commodities. It wasn't until the South decided to leave the Union that the North objected. The North knew it could not survive without the Southern money. That is the true definition of hypocrisy.


MYTH  -   Abraham Lincoln was the Great Emancipator.

FACT  -   While Lincoln has went down in history as the Great Emancipator, many would not care to hear his real thoughts on people of color. Martyred President Abraham Lincoln was fervently making plans to send all freed slaves to the jungles of Central America once the war was over. Knowing that African society would never allow the slaves to return back to Africa, Lincoln also did not want the slaves in the US. He thought the jungles of Central America would be the best solution and conducive to the freed slaves best interest. The only thing that kept this from happening, was his assassination.


MYTH  -   The South revered slavery.

FACT  -   A very interesting fact on slavery is that at the time the War of 1861 -1865 officially commenced, the Southern States were actually in the process of freeing all slaves in the South. Russia had freed it's servants in 1859, and the South took great note of this. Had military intervention not been forced upon the South, a very different America would have been realized then as well as now.


MYTH  -   The Confederate Army was comprised of rich slave owners.

FACT  -   Very far from true. The vast majority of soldiers in the Confederate Army were simple men of meager income. Most of which were hard working farmers and common men. Then, as now, very few rich men ever fight a war.


MYTH  -   Only the North had men of color in their ranks.

FACT  -   Quite simply a major falsehood of history. Many blacks, both free and of their own will, joined the Confederate Army to fight for their beloved Southern home. Additionally, men of other ethnic extraction fought as well. Oriental, Mexican & Spanish men as well as Native American Indians fought with pride for the South.

Today, many men of color are members in the heritage group SCV - Sons Of Confederate Veterans. These men of color and pride rejoice in their heritage. The continued attacks on the Southern Nation, The Confederacy, and her symbols are a terrible outrage to these fine people. These attacks should be denounced with as much fervor as those who denounce the South.


MYTH  -   The Confederate Flags are an authorized symbol of Aryan, KKK and hate groups.

FACT  -   Quite the contrary. These dispicable organizations such as the KKK and Aryans have taken a hallowed piece of history, and have plagued good Southern folks and the memories of fine Confederate Soldiers that fought under the flag with their perverse agenda. IN NO WAY does the Confederate Flag represent hate or violence. Heritage groups such as the SCV battle daily the damage done to a proud nation by these hate groups. The SCV denounces all hate groups, and pridefully boast HERITAGE - NOT HATE.


MYTH  -   The SCV - Sons Of Confederate Veterans are a racist, hate group.

FACT  -   This is a blatant attack on one of the finest heritage groups ever. The SCV - Sons Of Confederate Veterans are a historical, patriotic and non-political organization comprised of descendents of Confederate Soldiers and sailors dedicated to insuring that a true history of the 1861 -1865 period is preserved and presented to the public. The SCV continues to educate the public of the memory and reputation of the Confederate soldier as well as the motives for his suffering and sacrifice.

The SCV - Sons Of Confederate Veterans are in NO WAY affiliated with, nor does it recognize or condone the terrible legacy of hate groups such as the KKK.
[close]

Good points. :)

Offline Viriathus

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #197 on: July 02, 2015, 02:48:27 pm »
MYTH  -   The Confederate Battle Flag was flown on slave ships.

FACT  -   NONE of the flags of the Confederacy or Southern Nation ever flew over a slave ship. Nor did the South own or operate any slaves ships. The English, the Dutch and the Portugese brought slaves to this country, not the Southern Nation.
I think those portuguese were more likely to be spanish :P Remember some "small" spanish colonies in North America? Plus Portugal abolished slavery  during 1761 and 1777 in mailand and the nearby islands and finally in 1869 in the colonies. And banned slave trade in 1836...

But good points anyways ;)
« Last Edit: July 02, 2015, 02:53:31 pm by Viriathus »

Offline MaxLam

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #198 on: July 02, 2015, 04:37:06 pm »
Quote
- "Contrarily, Confederate General Robert E. Lee freed his slaves (which he never purchased - they were inherited) in 1862!!!"

Lie. He was forced to free the slaves as this was stated in the last will of his wife's father. He was supposed to do so within 5 years, which meant that he could free them immediately if he had wished to. Instead, he chose to use them during the whole 5 years. The guy who wrote this text is trying to have people believe that Lee freed the slaves of his own free will. Shameful.

Quote
It wasn't until the South decided to leave the Union that the North objected. [...] Lastly, and most importantly, why did NORTHERN States outlaw slavery only AFTER the war was over?
Revisionist nonsense.
- 1755: the Philadelphia Yearly Meeting ordered that members who imported slaves or purchased them locally should be admonished.
- 1777: Slavery is partially banned in Vermont.
- 1780: Pennsylvania passes An Act for the Gradual Abolition of Slavery, freeing future children of slaves. Those born prior to the Act remain enslaved for life. The Act becomes a model for other Northern states. Last slaves freed 1847
- 1783: New Hampshire begins a gradual abolition of slavery. Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court rules slavery unconstitutional, a decision based on the 1780 Massachusetts constitution. All slaves are immediately freed.
- 1787: Slavery is made illegal in the Northwest Territory.
- 1804: New Jersey begins a gradual abolition of slavery, freeing future children of slaves.[35] Those born prior to the Act remain enslaved for life.
- 1820: The Missouri Compromise bans slavery north of the southern boundary of Missouri.

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It is very important to keep in mind that the Confederate Battle Flag was simply just that. A battle flag.
Stupid and shameful statement. War, as Clausewitz said, is a mere continuation of politics by other means.

Quote
A very interesting fact on slavery is that at the time the War of 1861 -1865 officially commenced, the Southern States were actually in the process of freeing all slaves in the South. Russia had freed it's servants in 1859, and the South took great note of this. Had military intervention not been forced upon the South, a very different America would have been realized then as well as now.
And yet they seceded to defend their "peculiar institution"? They were probably stupid.  ;D

Quote
The Confederate Army was comprised of rich slave owners.
Who said something like that? Do you seriously believe that anyone said that all soldiers of the Confederate Army were rich? Lmao. No, but it's a fact that 1/3 of their soldiers owned slaves or came from slave-owning families, and half of their officer owned slaves.

Quote
IN NO WAY does the Confederate Flag represent hate or violence.
WTF. War is not violence now? Such nonsense.



Quote
Many blacks, both free and of their own will, joined the Confederate Army to fight for their beloved Southern home.
OMG. The difference is that in the North they were free, while in the South they were slaves. On March 13, 1865,the Confederate Congress passed a bill to enlist black men, but the bill never said that they would obtain their freedom. Now you might be able to find some slaves who fought with the Union, and some free African Americans who fought for the South, but you can't dismiss the main idea: While the North started giving their liberty to slaves who enlisted in the army decades before the American Civil War, the South enlisted slaves.

Quote
These Federals were ones that ended up crying the loudest about slavery. But without their ships, many of the slaves would have never arrived here. They made countless fortunes on the delivery of slaves as well as the products madefrom raw materials such as cotton and tobacco in the South.
That's probably true, at least until the importation of Africans was banned. But it's not because some people in the North were guilty and made profits from slavery that the South is less guilty. Nobody claimed that the North was perfect.

Quote
. Many Northern civilians owned slaves. Prior to, during and even after the War Of Northern Aggression.
It's true that some Union states allowed slavery, the 5 of them had a border with the South and 4 of them were under the Mason-Dixon line. Actual northern states, however, had very few slaves. According to the 1790 census, 94 percent of the 698,000 U.S. slaves lived below the Mason-Dixon Line. Missouri was the only slave state above the Mason-Dixon line.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2015, 04:39:34 pm by MaxLam »

Offline junedragon

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #199 on: July 02, 2015, 05:07:38 pm »
I cant help but laugh heartily every time someone refers to it as "the War of Northern Aggression".
Why am I still here

Offline MaxLam

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #200 on: July 02, 2015, 05:17:29 pm »
It's just that they wanted to enslave people in peace, as they loved their slaves. South = Peace & Love.

Offline Devmc99

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #201 on: July 02, 2015, 06:54:47 pm »
I cant help but laugh heartily every time someone refers to it as "the War of Northern Aggression".
* Fires first shot* " War of Northern Aggression!! "

Offline Nipplestockings

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #202 on: July 02, 2015, 08:22:44 pm »
I cant help but laugh heartily every time someone refers to it as "the War of Northern Aggression".

This lol. It's so ridiculous. No war is named by its aggressors. You don't call the Franco-Prussian war the War of Prussian aggression, or WW2 the War of German aggression. It's just not how it's done. And then people try to argue that it's 'technically more accurate' or some bullshit. Maybe it's accurate, maybe it isn't. That isn't how you fucking name wars though.

Offline MaxLam

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #203 on: July 02, 2015, 08:40:24 pm »

Offline junedragon

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #204 on: July 02, 2015, 09:07:30 pm »
Breaking: Texas is at war with the New York Times



Civil War 2: Electric Boogaloo confirmed
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Offline Nipplestockings

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #205 on: July 02, 2015, 09:08:45 pm »
Oh man, why the fuck would you put green peas in guac. That is disgusting.

Offline dukeofwellington

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #206 on: July 05, 2015, 03:50:57 am »
I think it is silly and childish. People who oppose the flag for the sake of some fun are the uneducated majority that a lot of the States has. Shouldn't State governments have better things to do to prosper their state? Doesn't the Federal US government have 100 better things to do that will advance their country domestically and internationally? I think every level of American government has become corrupt over the years and it will keep declining into oblivion unless some sane person takes charge and leads the country back into being a great power, for one the Education can be upped 100 % if the eighth graders took the Test of 1912 I bet not one would pass to high school. And people are complaining about a historic flag? fail...

Offline usnavy30

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #207 on: July 05, 2015, 06:17:25 pm »
Those people..

..got triggered
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Hello.. I have a problem... It says I don't have Mount&Blade Warband: Napoleonic War and I have to buy it
Try joining a regular Napoleonic Wars server and then re-running the installer.

Offline TheRedRedcoat

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #208 on: July 05, 2015, 10:19:50 pm »
Question: Not trying to link the confederacy and Nazi Germany, but the nazi flag doesn't appear in any of our games really (hearts of iron, men of war), so do you think the confederate flag will be banned from games?

Offline Nick Lazanis

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Re: Thoughts about "Confederate Flag" being banned
« Reply #209 on: July 05, 2015, 10:21:10 pm »
Nazi flag actually does apparear in quite a few games. I personally don't relate these 2 flags together,just not the same.