Author Topic: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.  (Read 10231 times)

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Offline Willhelm

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #30 on: February 27, 2014, 12:21:09 pm »
Wasn't my goal to insult you, it just annoys me you're saying something isn't broken when you can clearly see the crosshair offset when switching from one perspective to the other. I personally prefer the third person perspective in this game, that's why I was asking if it can be fixed because there are also huge advantages when using it. Anyway, this thread isn't for discussing the third person perspective, I've opened up another one for that where you can see the screenshots of the offset.

It annoys me that you're saying something is broken when hundreds of people use it with no issue. Third-Person is the preference of most people who play Warband. If there was really a significant issue with it, there would be far more people voicing their complaints but so far, you're the only person to go as far as calling it broken or unusable. That and the fact that several people have pointed out valid arguments against your claim, most of which, you've failed to refute and simply ignore.

So the majority of  numbers suddenly weights more than facts supported by evidence?

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So you don't see anything wrong in those screenshots? I never said it was unusable, I said you're at a big disadvantage against someone using first person in a shootout and therefore when it comes to combat it's broken (It can still be used for FoV advantages). Broken stuff can still be used tho and you can adapt to it, but you will still be at a disadvantage.

The whole point of this is that I want to find out if it's hardcoded or not, haven't got an answer to that question yet.

You know this isn't specific to IE right, this is the same across all warband mods and native, they can't do much about it.

Offline Killington

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #31 on: February 27, 2014, 02:02:52 pm »
Momcilo, I'm going to quote my post that I made a few days ago about that issue.

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No one is doubting that the reticle is off in third person mode, but what we're saying is that you can learn to adjust for the difference and aim using the reticle just as a vague guide. This allows you to shoot consistently in third person view, which has a lot of benefits, the expanded field of view, no crosshairs in the way (admittedly not a big issue with a dot crosshair mod) and being able to peek around corners.

The benefit of looking around corners (or tops of trenches) should not be underestimated, because it means that you can spot them and see where they are relative to you and then un-crouch/move forward a bit without having to change views, which is comparable to having to un-scope after a shot with the sniper (needed nerf but still kind of annoying), having to re-sight the target in the first person mode after switching only takes a split second, but it counts.

Also, I can actually pull off headshots easily with third person, but I usually aim for the chest because it works just as well (unless I'm fighting a Wachposten, but they are special and don't count).

In addition to that, I don't think it's even possible for them to make a third person reticle that is accurate at all ranges.
In theory we could do huge player numbers far over 500 players per server...  As such we will surely keep our promise to deliver you the 500 players per server.

We will probably go (far) over it, but that's for later.

Offline Momcilo

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #32 on: February 27, 2014, 04:12:40 pm »
Ye I already knew it's Warbands problem but thanks for the info, that's all I wanted to know  :D Gona cross it out from the suggestions.

Offline Rigadoon

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #33 on: February 27, 2014, 10:27:41 pm »
Wasn't my goal to insult you, it just annoys me you're saying something isn't broken when you can clearly see the crosshair offset when switching from one perspective to the other. I personally prefer the third person perspective in this game, that's why I was asking if it can be fixed because there are also huge advantages when using it. Anyway, this thread isn't for discussing the third person perspective, I've opened up another one for that where you can see the screenshots of the offset.

It annoys me that you're saying something is broken when hundreds of people use it with no issue. Third-Person is the preference of most people who play Warband. If there was really a significant issue with it, there would be far more people voicing their complaints but so far, you're the only person to go as far as calling it broken or unusable. That and the fact that several people have pointed out valid arguments against your claim, most of which, you've failed to refute and simply ignore.

So the majority of  numbers suddenly weights more than facts supported by evidence?
The fact that the reticle very slightly off is true, I never said otherwise and I don't see why you bring it up repeatedly. Nobody denies that there isn't a problem. But yes, majority of numbers does weigh more. It demonstrates to us that this problem is so tiny, irrelevant that most people don't care about it. The only time it has and will ever truly be a game affecting issue for someone, is if that person refuses to spend five minutes playing with it to adapt to it and instead complains about it.

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I never said it was unusable,
That's actually almost exactly what you said. Your other thread's title is "This mod isn't playable from the third person perspective."

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I said you're at a big disadvantage against someone using first person in a shootout and therefore when it comes to combat it's broken (It can still be used for FoV advantages). Broken stuff can still be used tho and you can adapt to it, but you will still be at a disadvantage.
Why? If you adapt to something, that's it, you're on an equal playing field to others. That's the point of adapting and there is no disadvantage about it at all. And again, as Killington and I have stated multiple times, there are a bunch of advantages to playing in third person that far outweigh this imaginary disadvantage you see.


I am glad you have decided to stop pushing it as a suggestion.

Offline super_ninja185

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #34 on: February 27, 2014, 11:27:11 pm »
Sadly this mod seems to be dieing really fast. I really liked this mod even though it has it's flaws. I understand you guys are working hard on this mod. I really hope to try to keep this mod alive, hope to see a update soon.

Offline Xanderman

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2014, 07:45:09 am »
Sadly this mod seems to be dieing really fast. I really liked this mod even though it has it's flaws. I understand you guys are working hard on this mod. I really hope to try to keep this mod alive, hope to see a update soon.
Blame the HvB server.

Offline Momcilo

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #36 on: February 28, 2014, 03:59:26 pm »
Wasn't my goal to insult you, it just annoys me you're saying something isn't broken when you can clearly see the crosshair offset when switching from one perspective to the other. I personally prefer the third person perspective in this game, that's why I was asking if it can be fixed because there are also huge advantages when using it. Anyway, this thread isn't for discussing the third person perspective, I've opened up another one for that where you can see the screenshots of the offset.

It annoys me that you're saying something is broken when hundreds of people use it with no issue. Third-Person is the preference of most people who play Warband. If there was really a significant issue with it, there would be far more people voicing their complaints but so far, you're the only person to go as far as calling it broken or unusable. That and the fact that several people have pointed out valid arguments against your claim, most of which, you've failed to refute and simply ignore.

So the majority of  numbers suddenly weights more than facts supported by evidence?
The fact that the reticle very slightly off is true, I never said otherwise and I don't see why you bring it up repeatedly. Nobody denies that there isn't a problem. But yes, majority of numbers does weigh more. It demonstrates to us that this problem is so tiny, irrelevant that most people don't care about it. The only time it has and will ever truly be a game affecting issue for someone, is if that person refuses to spend five minutes playing with it to adapt to it and instead complains about it.

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I never said it was unusable,
That's actually almost exactly what you said. Your other thread's title is "This mod isn't playable from the third person perspective."

Quote
I said you're at a big disadvantage against someone using first person in a shootout and therefore when it comes to combat it's broken (It can still be used for FoV advantages). Broken stuff can still be used tho and you can adapt to it, but you will still be at a disadvantage.
Why? If you adapt to something, that's it, you're on an equal playing field to others. That's the point of adapting and there is no disadvantage about it at all. And again, as Killington and I have stated multiple times, there are a bunch of advantages to playing in third person that far outweigh this imaginary disadvantage you see.


I am glad you have decided to stop pushing it as a suggestion.

It amazes me how you keep ignoring facts just because the majority says otherwise. No, facts can't be overruled just because the majority things otherwise because facts are supported by evidence and beliefs are not. By your logic, when people believed the earth was flat that was true eh? The offset isn't slight, it's 50% off at medium range.

And you keep ignoring what I'm saying about the adaptability thing - no matter how much you adapt you will always be that one second slower and that will cost you in a straight up fight with an opponent of equal skill.

But since it's hardcoded there is no point in continuing the talk about the crosshair.


Offline [15th]Harvain

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #37 on: February 28, 2014, 08:07:14 pm »
Sadly this mod seems to be dieing really fast. I really liked this mod even though it has it's flaws. I understand you guys are working hard on this mod. I really hope to try to keep this mod alive, hope to see a update soon.
Blame the HvB server.

Guess we need to do a Fire & Sword HvB, seeing as that game, on 1 server has more than half of IE's pop atm, that game needs killed!  ;D
Co-killer of the Iron Europe mod for Napoleonic Wars.

Offline Rigadoon

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Re: Things you need to do if you wish to keep this mod alive.
« Reply #38 on: February 28, 2014, 11:58:39 pm »
It amazes me how you keep ignoring facts just because the majority says otherwise. No, facts can't be overruled just because the majority things otherwise because facts are supported by evidence and beliefs are not. By your logic, when people believed the earth was flat that was true eh? The offset isn't slight, it's 50% off at medium range.
Your reading comprehension seems to be lacking. I'm not sure I should even bother re-presenting arguments that others and myself have already stated as you've repeatedly demonstrated that you are not capable of understanding them, but I will try. I never stated that facts can be overruled by the majority and I have already stated that I agree that the following fact is true; Fact: The crosshair is offset. As I just said, I agree with this. Understand? Okay, let's move on. The majority does not overrule that fact, however, the majority does provide us with another fact. That fact is; The majority of Iron Europe players do not find the offset crosshair to be a significant problem and do not believe it negatively affects their gameplay experience. This fact, yes it is a fact(And will remain so until their is a significant shift in opinion. In such a case, I will fully agree with you) tells us that this offset crosshair(Just in case you forget for the twentieth time, I agree that it is offset) is something that most can easily overcome and is not in immediate need of fixing, not that there's a way to fix it anyways.

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And you keep ignoring what I'm saying about the adaptability thing - no matter how much you adapt you will always be that one second slower and that will cost you in a straight up fight with an opponent of equal skill.
Once again, I did not ignore it. I do not ignore any part of your messages, unlike you, who has repeatedly ignored parts of mine especially when I completely destroy one of your points. Such as right here;
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I never said it was unusable,
That's actually almost exactly what you said. Your other thread's title is "This mod isn't playable from the third person perspective."
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Anyways, the disagreement here is that you've mistaken adapting for compensating. When you adapt to the bugged crosshair, you automatically aim where you know the real crosshair is pointing, there's no thought to it as your gameplay experience has taught you how to use it properly. There is no delay whatsoever. Not a single split second. Whereas when you compensate for it, you aim as if the bugged crosshair works properly, then adjust it to the proper place, that takes extra time.

It's time this thread is locked. You've gotten a response that you agree with for all of your technical issues, from Olafson and Wilhelm. Plus, there's no need for your simple suggestions to be held on a pedestal above the other ones that people have posted in the perfectly fine Suggestion thread. If you want, you're free to continue to debate me about the crosshair on the Suggestion thread or through PM, though, I most likely will not respond, as both of us know that it is a waste of time. Your social suggestions do intrigue me, so I'd love for you to open a new thread where we can discuss those. Since those are not suggestions that concern the contents of the mod itself, which is what the Suggestion thread is for, it deserves its own thread.